Anya Kamenetz Generation Debt

Yahoo! Finance User - Wednesday, January 23, 2008, 11:40PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 3/5

There seems to be a new definition of adolesence in this country. It starts with the hormones (earlier than my generation) but continues sometimes into the thirties. You call these the debt generation. Well put. But you would consider financing these lazy brats as they change jobs. That will be their ruination. Hooray to those who hold two and three jobs like we did until we had "the job". And further, your advice in another article that C cards are for emergencies is terrible. All the personal finance experts I respect say that when you first use a card for an emergency you should cut it up. If you do not pay it off at the end of the month, you are a slave to the card. Slavery is NOT out of fashion.

Yahoo! Finance User - Monday, January 21, 2008, 11:52PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

I have reviewed the writings from this author as a whole and found new worthwhile knowledge. I would love for someone to enlighten me if there is some valuable piece of information I have missed after exhaustive review looking for something, anything. The honorable thing to do would be to just stop writing trash and let a more qualified person takeover

Yahoo! Finance User - Monday, January 21, 2008, 8:18PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 5/5

I think this next generation is not a bunch of slackers in the least. They simply have little incentive to work like their parents and grand-parents did. If the $34,000/year (year=1979) is true then we have lost a terrible amount of ground for a majority of Americans. $34,000 per year in 1979 is over $100,000 per year in todays dollars. Simply apply the Consumer Price Index (CPI) for urban consumers (the inflation rate) rate from 1979 to now. On Jan 1st 1979 the CPI index was 68.5 on Dec 1st 2007 the index was 211. That's about 3 current (2008) dollars to every single, yes one, 1979 dollar. Both the Democrats and Republicans are unwilling address/admit to full extent that the standard of living (at least for most citizens) has declined over the last 20 to 30 years. Toss the Family Income nonsense out - what's important is per unit of work what each individual person makes now (in 2008) as compared to 1979. The Center for Economic and Policy Research chronicled the declining "good job" in a report by economist John Schmitt, released in November. They defined a "good job" as one that paid at least $17 an hour in 2006 dollars, or $34,000 a year -- the median pay for men in 1979 -- and boasted both a pension and health insurance.

Yahoo! Finance User - Saturday, January 19, 2008, 1:40PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 5/5

I give Anya 5 stars. Because... She has the courage to put herself out there, along with the facts. I have been both employee and employer. I've been duped by both, and enhanced by both. To the best of my ability, in both I have put my best foot foward. I have since realized a lot. If in either situation you want to be sucessful, look at the environment. Is it a greenhouse for sucess? Or failure? You can't blame this generation too much! First they are a product of the previous generation! Second they are not stupid! They are probably much better educated, (for the most part) because of the technology of today. So they see through a lot of the " I have a carrot for you tactics" that I have seen in my own experience. Integrity is integrity. Whether you are an employee or employer. Besides if greatness is your goal, then let your goal be, to be a great servant! Cause happiness seems to be somthing that we all want, but varies from person to person as to what would make them happy. I dont know about you, but if I haven't eaten for a long time, saltines and a glass of water make me happy!

Yahoo! Finance User - Saturday, January 19, 2008, 11:37AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

I hope she's correct. Though I would never assume anything she says is correct. If she is correct, lot's of slackers in my generation will be seeking their inner selves or something like that while i'm getting the job done. Check back if you found your innerself when your 43... you'll find me on my yacht.

Yahoo! Finance User - Friday, January 18, 2008, 9:36PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 3/5

I really wasn't really clear on the point of her ramble, other than to try to make some distinction between today's workers and yesteryear's workers. There have already been tons of media op-eds and articles which have chronicled the decline of traditional well-benefited, more permanent jobs, counterpointed by the rise of flakier service-industry jobs and various temporary contract work. If she wanted to provide a richer context, it would have been nice to see a wider array of quantitative data documenting both the growth of low wage work against the backdrop of declining home affordability and rapidly escalating costs of other core expenses poorer working-class people require to survive, such as gas and food. Fifty years ago, you could go almost any place in the US and buy a home for rarely more than 2-3 times the median income of the neighborhood. You would be lucky to get a home today for less than 4-6 times the median income, and in most major cities that ratio is closer to 10-15 times the local median income. Today's kids are not lazier at all. The means to the "American Dream" is simply more expensive relative to wages than in any time in the last century. This suggests that the optimistic hype heard frequently opined in the media about the how living standards have risen over the years is pure nonsense. Balancing the decline of housing affordability against the rise of cheap gadgetry and amusements as a sign of "better" living standards is intellectually dishonest. It is akin to the emperors of Rome citing Coliseum games as progress, where the spectacle of watching Christians being ripped to pieces by wild animals was a sign of an advanced and happy civilization. Even when you throw in advances in medical therapy, that one glowing beacon of true advancement is mostly shrouded by it's increasing unavailability to the public, either because a person can not afford insurance or is denied treatment by insurance. Look at today's news, a parapeligic man dumped in a gutter by a hospital. What good is advancement in health care if those who need it don't get it, or worse if the advancement is offset by active patient harm? Young peoples' perceptions are not the problem, as they seem the same as when I was their age. The problem is that living wages are less common and basic living expenses much higher now than 50 years ago.

Yahoo! Finance User - Friday, January 18, 2008, 9:25PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 2/5

Anya, shame on you!!! SHAME SHAME SHAME. I am agreeing with the 25 years old commentor who left their comment on 7th Jan at approx 4.07pm. By the way did you know that during the WW2 there were some of the lowest suicide rates in the world. Do you know why, because people got on with it. They didnt sit around whinging...as you seem to encourgae. Lets be honest Anya, these whingers keep your profile up. Of course relatively speaking, by a certain age, Gen Y is going to be more intelligent that Gen X. Subsequently Gen X is ahead of Baby Boomers. Thats their job, to surpass the previous generation otherwise we would still be throwing spears and chasing animals for our lunch. Thats evolution, every generation goes further than the last. Anya, I also respect the fact that every generation struggles. Hey I have been there myself, as have all my friends. What I dont respect about your work Anya is that you turn it into a "cottage industry". God Bless America.

Yahoo! Finance User - Friday, January 18, 2008, 7:23PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 4/5

For a moment, I thought I was reading an old PT column. Anya did give the adults a fair shake about "being happy = being a worthless bum", unlike PT. She's busy channeling anger into bathroom downward dog. 1 additional star for effort to break out of the bi-weekly budget column. It would have been 2 except for promoting the writers union.

Yahoo! Finance User - Friday, January 18, 2008, 3:36PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 4/5

I blame our society on MTV not playing music videos. If they just played music videos things would be so much better.

Yahoo! Finance User - Friday, January 18, 2008, 3:18PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 4/5

I think Anya is coming into her own. This is a good article. I am 39 and don't really see that much difference between generations other than technology. When I entered the work force at 21, there were go-getters my age and some lazy people my age as well. I also saw the same attributes from older workers at that time. Today, not much has changed. Sure, I shake my head sometimes at the outlandish expectations, poor dress, and lack of professionalism from some of my younger co-workers. But I see the same thing in older workers as well. We over-generalize the generations and have to remind ourselves that there are good and bad people of all ages. I'm glad that I am no longer the "know-it-all" newbie in the office. But I sure hope I never turn into a jaded old-timer who refuses to admit when a younger counterpart has a good idea or does a better job than I do.

Yahoo! Finance User - Friday, January 18, 2008, 1:41PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

I consider this generation as 'Generation xDD' where x could stand for anything, D stands for deficit, and D stands for Disorder. :-)

Yahoo! Finance User - Friday, January 18, 2008, 11:38AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

Gen Debt should be renamed Gen Lazy. I have been in the workforce for 9 years, and have a great job with good pay and benefits. It came at the price of hard work and some sacrifice. When I look around at my peers that are fresh out of school to 29 yrs old, those that work hard are in the same boat as me with a good job with benefits. The others in this group that complain about not havign the job of their dreams, or having the correct work life balance carry on their lives with a sense of entiltement that has a false foundation rooted in a spoiled upbringing. They overcome material goods whithout the economic ability to do so, overutilizing debt to be driving flashy new sports cars and SUVs. They do not want to and in some cases do not know how to work hard to put themselves in a position to have the good job with pay and benefits. They spend their energy compaining about their current predicament instead of chasing a plan that puts them where they want to be. The workplace is a highly competetive environment. Gen Lazy is getting left behind, and blame everyone for their plight, except themselves.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 10:46PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 2/5

It looks like 99% of the posters here both 1 star and 5 star alike missed Anyas real opinion in the third paragraph under Getting Real - "But my view is that a lifetime of job-hopping won't do much to replace bad jobs with good ones". In other words, she is NOT supporting job hopping so much as pointing out that it is a growing trend among workers. So most of the 1 stars are bashing her for supporting their position and the 5 stars are cheering her for not supporting theirs, go figure! Out of all of the posts, the one that made the most sense was from Iczermoon 1/16 1:17 PM, I recommend reading it. The age steroetyping going on here is ridiculous, too many boomers have forgotten what it was to be that age and the young ones seem to forget that one day, they too will be boomer age. All young people think they are going to correct all of the 'evils' done by their parents only to grow up and do the same thing. Very few posters are criticizing young people for looking for happiness in the perfect job, but the fact is that there is not a perfect job for everyone. About the best you can hope for is to find a field you enjoy and hope to land a decent pating job working in it. The bottom line is that happiness comes from within and until you find that, no amount of job hopping will net you any happiness.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 4:29PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 3/5

Speaking as a boomer with 30 years in the workforce, I didn't think this was a bad article. I can't say I work closely with any Gen Y types so it provided somewhat of an interesting read on that group--providing the sources were representative of that generation. The notion of work providing fulfillment, creativity and passion isn't unique to the Y generation; I started out there my self and tried to find jobs where I was compensated fairly, provided challenging work and was treated well by my superiors. For the most part, I succeeded. There were times where I didn't push the boss on $ because I enjoyed the job but I did find that if you're doing something you enjoy, somehow, the money takes care of itself. Similarly, the jobs I enjoyed the most had a lot of give and take between me and my boss; if extra hours were needed, they 'd get them. Conversely, I woudn't be pressed about taking time off if I needed it. It was about the relationship working for both parties and not abusing that relationship. Anyway, my view of the job landscape these days is that is has changed greatly since I was a newly minted BSBA back in the 70's. Organizations, generally, seem to care less about the individuals value to the organization--unless they're are an executive--and are less inclined to invest in the employee and their well being. Given the global competition in th e world for goods and services, companies have a lot more choices for sourcing their employment requirements and they are not shy about looking at outsourcing traditional jobs. I think what the Y generation members might keep in mind is that this change in the relationship between employer and employee which we;ve seen, certainly in the past decade, is now all about leverage--who's got it and who doesn't. If you have some unique skills or if you have to be located in an area where there is not a of job talent around, the employee has that leverage to cut the best deal they can with their employer. On the other hand, If you don't have those skills, don't expect to be treated with much deference by your employer. You'll be viewed as a replaceable widget and will be removed when "quality time and work satisfaction issue" is raised. My advice would be to get as much training as you can on your own and bring that to the job with you. Don't count on an employer investing a lot of training $ on you until they think you're a keeper.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 4:12PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

Where does Yahoo keep finding these novices? Anya's bio does not even list any relevant degrees she might have earned to qualify her to give financial advice here. Maybe she is not even a college grad?

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 4:07PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

I am 25 years old and I am so tired of articles like this being written about people in my generation. We all act like we're so different from other generations. The idea that we don't care about high paying jobs or job security is idiotic. Anyone who says otherwise (like Mr. Aiken who by the way is clearly just trying to get a book deal out of this) is someone without a family or any responsibilities or is just saying what seems like the right thing to say. I am sorry but flexibility and the people who I work with are only incidental considerations for most people in my generation next to salary and job security. It's time for people in my age group to stop being little kids and start acting like adults. News flash, adulthood begins at 18 or at the latest, 22, not 28. We're no different than any other generation and it's time to stop acting like it. Maybe if people would have thought ahead about what jobs would be good for them or what jobs would well before or during college, they wouldn't be in terrible jobs that are miserable. The author is only making the problem worse by constantly pandering to the underachievers in my age group who whine about their life and act like it's ok to be amatuerish well into their late twenties. They only seek reinforcement from others that our generation is different and because of that it's alright to underachieve. The author also humors the people who identify with this article by saying that these people aren't "settling". Give me a break, these people are only saying they are seeking happiness and therefore taking lower pay because they can't get a high paying job. This is all just a cover for the idiots I have grown up with to make up for the fact that they goofed around well into and after college and are now "paying" the consequences. I wonder what excuses these people will use for their underachievements once we all reach the age of 30 and we can't say that we are still growing up and aren't adults anymore. I guess from my point of view it's great for me and other people my age who have been motivated and used our time during and after college wisely. We'll easily be able to climb the corporate ladder because we'll have been taking our lives seriously since the day we graduated high school or college. The author has made a cottage industry by pandering to the myth that people my age are different and "special". I'll take a few tough days at the office for more money because later in life and in retirement I won't be working, I bet I'll be a hell of alot happier than the people who take a different job once a week. At lease this guy works, although I wonder how much money his helicopter parents give him each month?

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 3:18PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

Happiness is having a great family, some good friends and being busy. Anywhere you go there'll be thing to like and dislike, applying oneself an dtrying one's best is part of making youself happy, flitting about won't ever give any lasting satisfaction. It may be a symptom of a restless and shallow mind.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 1:57PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 3/5

Any time an author tries to cast an entire age group in stereotypical terms, you are going to get the people who say "I'm 28 and this is a bunch of bunk, I work in a stable job, yada yada yada," or "I'm 48 and the world's going to end because these 20-year-olds only care about themselves." The fact is, there's a bit of truth in most stereotypes, including the "Gen Debt" ones. I'm not really sure what this article adds to the discussion, but it is absolutely true that many employers are struggling to retain younger workers because this group of workers has different priorities. Whether that means the workers will ultimately win out and get what they want, or whether they're in for the rude awakening some of the older posters suggest, is debatable, but there's no question that in recent years, the shift toward more flexibility, more family-friendly policies, etc. has accelerated. The number of people in my company working remotely (from home) has skyrocketed in the last 10 years, and we just got a memo from one of our most senior managers saying that we should look to foster these kinds of arrangements if that's what it takes to keep quality people around. The one thing I'd take issue with in the article (other than that it really doesn't make much of a point) is the assertion that a "good" job includes a pension (not Anya's assertion, but the think tanks). If this is referring to a traditional pension, that's absurd because almost no one outside certain government jobs is offering these any more to new employees, and many firms are freezing benefits for existing employees. With people living as long as they are, the liability of traditional pensions just doesn't make sense... the idea of your company paying you a good chunk of your final salary from the time you retire at 60 until you die at 80, 85 or whatever for doing nothing is ridiculous. However, more and more firms are adopting 401(k)'s with generous matches, and in the face of huge health care cost increases, it's still the case at most large companies that they are hugely subsidizing the cost of health insurance. I have a good-paying job with a company that offers good time off benefits, significant flexibility, a 100% 401(k) match on 3% of salary and another 50% on the next 3% (plus another gratis contribution of about 1.25% of salary into your 401(k) whether you contribute or not as long as our profit for the year allows it, which it always does), good health benefits, etc.; if this would be classified as not a "good job" because we don't have a pension, that's absurd these days.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 10:30AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 5/5

What a lot of people don't know is that a lot of young people, nowadays, actually want good and stable jobs. However, they don't have much choice but to work in multiple jobs because they need to pay their bills. Additionally, there just aren't many entry-level jobs available for recent college graduates. A lot of young people are taking multiple jobs and are job-hopping because it's a mean for financial survival - not because of personal fulfillment and/or instant gratification, etc. Regardless, five stars for a beautifully written article by a beautiful writer. :-)

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 10:25AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

Correct! America needs to toughen up and hit the books. I live in South Korea where education has been the backbone of record growth. If we don't make changes Korea, China, and others will take even more of our jobs and markets. No I don't mean protectionism. I mean being the best, like we were in the past.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 10:14AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

This article looked frighteningly similar to a PT 'Junk in the Trunk' article. I hope this was just an exception.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 8:56AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 4/5

I am so sick of the widespread belief among boomers that coddled childhoods created a generation of lazy, self centered workers in constant need of validation. These same workers work longer hours then their parents, for less money, while facing more student debt. God forbid they might value happiness over the almightyt dollar in choosing a job.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 8:28AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 3/5

I read a newspaper article recently which discussed how to manage 20-somethings. It was quite comical that according to the author, this group is always looking for validation and to be told they are doing a great job. This is a result of them getting trophies at a young age whether they finished in first or last place. The author gave an example of a company where the owner makes it a point to congratulate and applaud his workers every 30 days. That's a scary thought that our society needs to praise and lump together the high and low achievers when across the Pacific, other cultures expect more from their children. That's why those cultures are now our competition...We need to toughen up America. Turn off American Idol, your iPods and your DVD's and start studying.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 12:14AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 5/5

some of you may just not like what this woman has to say - she is almost always right on.

Yahoo! Finance User - Thursday, January 17, 2008, 12:03AM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

The current generation is just not creating the diversity of jobs that previous generations had. U either do exactly the current big thing or nothing.

Yahoo! Finance User - Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 10:42PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

I see no sense in setting the 20s and 30s apart as though they are better and different in these regards. I'm in my 40s and living this way too.. and I see others doing the same. I hope that we're not going to do another Penelope Trunk deal with this younger worker has special lofty virtues shtick.

Yahoo! Finance User - Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 10:24PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 3/5

I can understand Sean's eagerness to persue his dream, but I feel insecure when not finding a stable job. Sometime I feel fatigue and lost when I am working for a disappointing job. This probably affect my working performance which also affect the growing of the city. Anyways, just find another job, I am young.

Yahoo! Finance User - Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 10:05PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 3/5

Anya is not advocating this behavior, she is merely reporting it. As an older worker of 48, I found the article very educational. This surely was not the attitude as when I entered the workforce 25 years ago. As a manager, I find this "job a week" mentality difficult to deal with. Seems like the root cause is the expectation of instant gratification these folks have. They don't understand that it typically takes many years to reach the desired income and position. You can't accomplish that by continually job hopping....

Yahoo! Finance User - Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 8:54PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

So Sean says that his generation is "not looking for job security and a high-paying salary? He believes that other things are more important in our decisions: job satisfaction, flexibility, the people you're working with." This article and the quotes are so naive. At 30 years old, I work at a multinational Fortune 500 company where I've been for over 8 years and I consider myself quite successful at this point in my life. I am there because it is a stable and very recognizable firm which offers job security and a competitive salary AND flexibility, benefits and fairly good coworkers. At work, we frequently have free onsite financial workshops for people of all age groups to discuss credit card debt, planning for starting a family, planning for retirement, how much difference it makes if you contribute 2% or 10%, and so on. The bottomline is, you don't have to sacrifice one thing for the other. No job is perfect but if you don't like yours, leave it and get a better one. To me, job security is important. I would like to know how many of these young people like Sean have a financial security net of 3 salaries or more for emergencies...From my experience, being 20 years old is fairly different from 30. At 20, you don't worry so much about financial responsibility, buying a house, starting a family, perhaps caring for older members of your family and so on...Quite honestly, this would be very difficult without money and savings. We're talking medical bills, mortgages, etc. With a little planning, it is possible. But if people like Sean don't care and all they want to do is have fun, fine. Let us know in 10 or 15 years how it worked out for you, Sean. Someone else in this post said that happiness is your family and friends and I second that. A job is just a job. You can always get one and everyone is replaceable. I look to Yahoo Finance for inspirational articles and ways how to get ahead financially. Reading this blab was a waste of time that got me nowhere and it is not helpful in anyway. If anything, it encourages the young generation to feel even more lost...

Yahoo! Finance User - Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 8:37PM ET  Report Abuse

• Overall: 1/5

I have to break the news - the world isn't going to trip over itself creating wonder jobs for young selfish child-averse double income couples, especially now that the cupboard is finally starting to go bare. P.S. You don't look particularly happy about your job.