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Vringo, Inc. Message Board

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  • U.S. firm alleges China’s government colluded with local competitor. When an American company named Vringo discovered that ZTE, a Chinese telecommunications giant, had been using patented mobile technology for years without paying license fees, the U.S. firm sought what it considered appropriate compensation.

    What followed, the company says, was an extraordinary mixture of deceit, protectionism and collusion on behalf of the Chinese company by Beijing government regulators, who then launched a retaliatory investigation into Vringo.

    The U.S. company’s complaint, now being heard by a New York court, shows how China’s government, companies and even courts sometimes collude to abuse patent protection, discriminate against foreign firms and unfairly protect local businesses, U.S. business leaders say.

    ZTE and lawyers acting on its behalf declined to comment, citing pending litigation. The Chinese commission did not respond to requests for comment

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • Once again thanks to VRNG24 for the all the great info. Disclosure I am long VRNG.

    The ZTE response is in on PACER and predictably they have asked the court for mercy. They admit that they are in breach of the courts orders and violated the terms of the NDA with disclosure to multiple 3rd parties. They propose their own low ball sanctions.

    ZTE main argument is that VRNG seeks sanctions that are not in line with the damages they caused (under rule 37b). They propose paying for all courts costs, attorneys fees and precluding themselves from introducing evidence during the future trial related to the breach.

    It is a poor argument but really the only one left but rule 37 is complex and gives a lot of discretion to the district court as long as there is a claim and the evidence (facts) supports the claim. Unfortunately (for ZTE) that bullet left the gun when they refused to produce Guo in SDNY. Again, in this document, they try to make him less relevant with the argument that he was so senior he had no idea what was really going on. The fact (his own emails) dispute this especially with the Chinese government suit. Kaplan will never buy it and I think he basically told this to ZTE when he warned them what may happen if Guo violates his order again - which ZTE then did.

    ZTE ... "We respectfully submit, however, that the sanctions proposed by Vringo—default judgment in the
    NDA case as well as dismissal and default judgment in the FRAND case—would not be appropriate"

    Kaplan ... "VRNG already told us they would seek litigation ending sanctions, what did u expect"

    ZTE ... "But we promise to produce everything they need now, give us till Oct 15th, we have new lawyers we are good guys!!"

    Kaplan ... "I told you twice to produce Guo?"

    ZTE ... "But he does not want to come and firing him will not help!!!!"

    Kaplan ... "Have you tried?"

    ZTE ... "Well no"

    Kaplan ... "onto the damages phase, VRNG do you have anything to share"

    VRNG ... "Lets talk FRAND"


  • so we lay down and give up, how is this possible with a validated patent, upheld by USPTO, am I still living in America, isn't this the foundation to capitalism. How is it possible for the USPTO to issue a patent, recieve a mans money, do a patent search, issue patents and all rights assigned only to have a fed circuit court to determine its common sense. you've got to be kidding. I now have lost all faith in justice. Justice my hindend, pure crookery, the little guy takes one again. this stinks and I think there should be an investigation into the judges who overturned the decision, and by what authority do they have the right to decide wether something is common sense. That could be said of many patented items, bobby pins, church keys, safety pins, toothpicks etc. what gives and where does this decision leave us. Are we becoming China, I'm sick and tired of the rigged system. I used to enjoy playing stock market, but lets face it, it's rigged, the little guy has no chance and 401 participants are being fleeced. Invest in America my backend, I honestly can't believe what I'm witnessing in this country. Lie , cheat, steal. Its no wonder morality is lost. Im sorry, but I was brought up believing in kindness, truthfulness, and having faith in mankind. What a joke. I've tried to raise my children the same. I believe i have done them an injustice. I now live in a country where our leader got elected based on a platform of lies. to this day he still lies whenever he opens his mouth and you wonder what example is he setting, he's undermined every parent in this country. It's no wonder we're going to hell in a hand basket. And while I'm raving about the crooked markets lets talk about what our president has done for achieving peace in the USA as well as the world. He's devided our country and used his race and people to achieve political gain. He could have been the greatest president ever, but no, this peace seeking piece of you know what has been a one man wrecking ball

  • Disclosure: I am long VRNG.

    Thanks again to VRNG24 for great information. Doc 256 is an impactful document that leaves the reader with very little choice as to the final outcome. We can't see all the redacted stuff but you can read between the lines and footnotes etc and get the gist of it. Some thoughts....

    1) ZTE leadership really is incompetent. They are basing their LEGAL strategy on the "Art of War". While the The Art of War is a great book, it should not be taken literally, especially during a FRAND negotiation. Sadly ZTE Executives forgot one of the books biggest themes - "Be moral and ethical in all things" and instead focused on "surprise tactics" and "make war to make peace". These type of tactics only work with unsophisticated actors not NPE's or PAE's whose entire team is not only experienced but are disciplined and executing a strategy not launching random lawsuits.

    2) ZTE are arrogant. Their own U.S. Subsidiary predicated this result back in April, it's now September, how much more evidence would you like to conceal, how much bigger do you want to dig the hole with the Judge? At some point you admit your mistakes and stop digging!

    3) ZTE have no believable defense for their behavior and will be sanctioned (the evidence is overwhelming ad easy to gauge their real intent). VRNG can't ask for damages yet (they will after we hear back from Kaplan) but ZTE best options now is to make sincere apologies to the court, fire their involved executives and hope the Court is lenient during damages phase.

    Obviously no one can predict what a judge or appeals court does (as we saw in the Google case) but make no mistake this lawsuit is not about obviousness or patentability, this case is about FRAND and forcing Chinese Corporations to respect ALL Intellectual Property, as they do their own.

  • Reply to

    ZTE response - DOC 265.

    by zeleration Sep 15, 2015 8:44 PM

    Disagree ... ZTE response is up so you can read it if full yourself, nothing misleading about my post and I disclosed that I am long the stock.

    Listen, I could have been worse on ZTE here are some direct excerpts from ZTE document (this is NOT A VRNG filing this is from ZTE attorneys) .... so if you don't think ZTE are admitting their mistakes and looking for mercy based on the interpretation of Rule 37b then I really don't know what to tell you but I would not be holding short way too risky now ...

    "ZTE has been unable to comply with the Court's orders regarding the deposition of Guo
    Xiaoming ("Mr. Guo") and the production of documents from more than 100 ZTE custodians".

    "The Court has already determined that ZTE breached the NDA by attaching the 40-page
    presentation to an anti-monopoly complaint filed by ZTE in Shenzhen, China in February 2014."

    "In addition, several other disclosures of NDA-protected information have taken place.
    The disclosures, however, have not been identical. In some instances, the entire 40-page
    presentation has been disclosed. This happened when ZTE filed its anti-monopoly complaint in Shenzhen and also when ZTE filed a complaint with China's National Development and Reform Commission in April 2014. In others, only the opening settlement offer from the 40-page presentation—a dollar amount—was disclosed. This number was disclosed to Margaret Wang of GOOGLE when ZTE forwarded a draft of ZTE's NDRC complaint to her in April 2014." -- I love that one!!!!.

    "The number also was included in internal reports on the Vringo dispute distributed within ZTE, one of which was forwarded to Mark Lee of Edelman, a PR firm used by ZTE, in August 2014. " -- The PR Firm - pricless !!!!

  • Reply to


    by ljfude Oct 16, 2015 9:48 AM

    pretty hard to teach children right from wrong when the leader of our own country spews lies left and right, what an example he sets. But it's OK they're politicians. Where the H am I living, wow is all I can say.

  • Reply to

    ZTE response - DOC 265.

    by zeleration Sep 15, 2015 8:44 PM

    cont ...

    ZTE have on multiple occasion asserted that they are the reasonable ones and it is VRNG who are not reasonable with their outrageous rack rate high pricing. While we do not know the big number we do know this from the documents and especially Exhibit B....

    ZTE Argument .....

    " Vringo has not established that testimony from Mr. Guo would be central to any claim or defense in either the NDA case or the FRAND case.2 There is evidence that Mr. Guo gave his approval to certain legal and public relations countermeasures against Vringo (countering the litigation and public relations measures taken by Vringo). (See Ex. B.) These countermeasures, however, were developed and implemented by subordinate executives—including Shen Jianfeng, Shen Nan and Hu Yi—who have appeared for depositions in New York. The countermeasures were also the subject of a corporate representative deposition pursuant to Rule 30(b)(6). (See Ex. C.) Vringo offers no reason to believe that information about these countermeasures—let alone
    "case dispositive" information—is missing from the case because Mr. Guo has not appeared for a deposition.

    OK, they are still downplaying Mr. Guo but the reference to Exhibit B is where it gets interesting and I hope VRNG will use this in damages...

    EXHIBIT B Excerpt from ZTE emails ....

    " Beginning of 2013, Vringo, through their English lawyer, made an application to the English court to make a
    judgment authorizing them to make an offer to our company for a global license in accordance with the payment terms of$2.5 USD per smart phone; $1.2 USD per sub-module; and 1.5% of revenue for systems".

    Typical FRAND rate are from .5% to 1.5% on standards based systems. The per device charges if you use the sum of the parts calculation on a $300 smart phone device come in right at the same levels.5% ~1.25%. The AXON is $450 so less there. Seems close enough to FRAND rates - wonder if Kaplan will agree?

  • "This was ZTE Romania`s NINTH (9th !!!) attempt to overturn and/or suspend the enforcement of the preliminary injunction since the preliminary injunction was granted on June 30, 2014."

    Wholey Cow !! What's wrong with the court system so as to allow 9 attempts, and still counting

  • Reply to

    ZTE Kindness

    by ojsmyth75 Sep 11, 2015 11:47 AM
    mdavid_ip_basher_masher_investor mdavid_ip_basher_masher_investor Sep 11, 2015 12:15 PM Flag

    You better watch your step ojsmyth75! Or you get our resident BULLY excited! You just about set him off just now!!!

    REPOST: EVERYONE knows ipinvestor is a long time Super-Spammer Troll!!!!!
    He posts under so many ID's he can't keep them all straight in his tiny brain, and constantly gets caught and then deletes his screw-ups. HE HATES to be disagreed with, and will NOT own up to being wrong or criticized. ANYONE who has a contrasting opinion is called stupid and insulted. In his mind he really believes he is an absolute authority on all things, especially when it comes to VRNG and banking. He is VERY immature and often paints the board with nonstop juvenile rantings under one of his "basher" IDs.

    I, as well as a few other longs believe he has severe mental problems that are barely kept under control by strong medications....that he sometimes skips.

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • ZTE investors are reading this stuff and starting to ask question of ZTE.

    BTW....If you want to business in USA you gonna PAY this time. Pay UP ZTE.


    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • The Stock Twit boys can not stop them now....Bad ZTE all over the internet....


    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • Do you really live in that shieethole? OMG!!! Goog Street view shows what I refer to as "the projects" and a few dumpy looking crakerboxes across the street. Wow!!! You have GOT to be kidding!!! Do you really live there?
    Now I know why you spend so much time on the computer and on message boards. ....anything to keep you from looking around at ALL your pitiful "accomplishments" I guess.

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • babooeybabbabooey=ipinvestor22 : Why did you feel the need to delete your wonderful confirmation message (that I responded to) that basically acknowledges you being one and the same person?

    WE ALL KNOW you habitually spam this board with more than just these two IDs...It is a FACT.
    You can’t help it.

    And....It's alright.
    Anyone who has been here for a while knows you are a "special" needs person! …and as such we should defer when making critical assessment of your “damaged” persona(s).

    I mean, it can’t be easy being you. Now that we know...I guess living in that scummy neighborhood day after day would wear on anyone's self-esteem.

    Sincerely, I myself, COULD NEVER do what you are doing… to live in a place like that!!! I guess it's just a cases where you being that “special” person really comes in handy! Just having the “basic” needs met must be a great satisfaction for someone of your limited ability. Take Care!

    Long and Strong VRNG!

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • mdavid_ip_basher_masher_investor mdavid_ip_basher_masher_investor Sep 10, 2015 1:07 PM Flag

    Hi a327zig! I see you met our resident BULLY! EVERYONE knows ipinvestor is a long time Super-Spammer Troll!!!!!
    He posts under so many ID's he can't keep them all straight in his tiny brain, and constantly gets caught and then deletes his screw-ups. HE HATES to be disagreed with, and will NOT own up to being wrong or criticized. ANYONE who has a contrasting opinion is called stupid and insulted. In his mind he really believes he is an absolute authority on all things, especially when it comes to VRNG and banking. He is VERY immature and often paints the board with nonstop juvenile rantings under one of his "basher" IDs.

    I, as well as a few other longs believe he has severe mental problems that are barely kept under control by strong medications, that he sometimes skips.

    To sum it up: A lot of us LONGS hate him and his constant pumping.

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • Reply to

    ZTE response - DOC 265.

    by zeleration Sep 15, 2015 8:44 PM

    Fantastic read. Thank you. You made it easy to understand and fun to read by cutting thru all the legalese and getting the facts out of the shell. Let's see how much longer this show will last as we need something done with to put a platform under us for the other cases.

    Sentiment: Buy

  • Once this thing halt , it will reopen at $9 shorts suicide mission will take it to $20

    Mark this post as I am sitting in the court room

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • If not ZTE $817 million is consolation priz $12 per share over long haul.. Just bought some more!!!!!!!!!

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • Is this the act of someone who is trying to prolong things even longer? It would not seem to be.
    Is this an indication that perhaps they are contemplating coming to terms finally? This whole charade
    is costing them tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars beyond whatever they will ultimately have to
    pay to Vringo. One would have to question the wisdom of continuing down this road.
    Agreeing to a Judge (Kaplan) to decide this will shorten things considerably I would have to think. It will
    lessen the expense and possibly be a venue where an agreement could be hammered out.
    I think this could be very telling about where this is headed and could shorten the timeline considerably
    as well.
    ZTE is in dire straights now. They are losing their cases against Vringo all over the world. They have injunctions against their products which are harming their business and sales. Their plans have been altered drastically due to the injunctions. Their projections for sales and production have been reduced due to these events as well. Meanwhile, many of their products will become obsolete as innovations and new products are introduced into markets all over the world. They will fall behind as their competition steals away their business and establishes relationships that will be hard to counter.
    Their failure to come to terms could cause them much more harm going forward. Stunt their growth and cause them to lose more and more market share to others. So does it really serve their purposes to continue to fight this battle costing them so much?

  • The only changes I see from the last week is Vringo advancing the NDA to a Summary Judgement, the acquisition that appears to add $7 million in Revenue(where none existed), and the court docs released by Vringo that informs Huawei has been served. All reasons that suggest this $40 million market cap is incredibly undervalued.

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

  • CLear 40 cents tomorrow over that 39 cents oct 30 on volume as good as today time will be to add..

    Sentiment: Strong Buy

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