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American Capital, Ltd. Message Board

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  • engie095 engie095 Feb 17, 2012 1:40 AM Flag

    What exactly is negative about the results that ACAS reported?

    Is the main thing you're trying to get clarification on the issue of unrealized losses and whether to actually count them in estimating loss carryforward?

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    • Its_Not_My_Business_But Its_Not_My_Business_But Feb 17, 2012 10:29 AM Flag

      >> Is the main thing you're trying to get clarification on the issue of unrealized losses and whether to actually count them in estimating loss carryforward?

      Basically, yes.

      If you look at the table on pg 40 of the Q3-11 10Q .. you'll see the tax asset for the realized losses .. I get that is in the past.

      Then you have 3 more lines .. and all of them seem to be the maximum potential benefit IF .. big IF .. all those sources of the tax-benefit were actually realized.

      So, in the unrealized ordinary loss line, I think that might be the what the tax asset WOULD BE .. IF ALL of the sources of ordinary losses were realized at the current valuations.

      The next line . difference in basis .. does with the prior ..

      The next line is if all the outstanding options were exercised ..

      The question I have is what happens if none of that stuff is realized, but they run out the ordinary losses line?

      Or are they going to strategically realize losses to keep this going .. basically strategically moving items from lines 2-5 up into line 1.

      NMB

      • 1 Reply to Its_Not_My_Business_But
      • Its_Not_My_Business_But Its_Not_My_Business_But Feb 17, 2012 11:35 AM Flag

        We'll have to wait to see the 10k and find the comparable table as to the one of the 10Q from Q3-11, but here is the skinny.

        The only ACTUAL losses carried forward that they can take advantage of NOW is the first line .. realized ordinary losses (which should be around $150-$200M).

        ALL THE OTHER LINES IN THE TAX-ASSET ARE HYPOTHETICAL .. based upon the current fair valuation of the portfolio and assuming all the available stock-option-compensation are converted.

        So .. bottom line is this.

        If ACAS DOES NOT HAVE >$1B IN LOSSES CURRENTLY TO OFFSET INCOME.

        THEY HAVE ~$150M-$200M.

        If they don't realize those other assets that are contributing to the "unrealized losses" line .. which are also the same assets that are contributing "cost basis" line ..

        .. ACAS might still burn though their ordinary losses this year.

        Once we see the 10K, we can compare the tables from the past filings and see how these items are changing over time.

        NMB

 
ACAS
15.74+0.22(+1.42%)Jul 25 3:59 PMEDT

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