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VMware, Inc. Message Board

  • fool100pct fool100pct Mar 14, 2008 12:52 PM Flag

    How much does MS really care about VMW (repost as a new topic)

    Repost from a different thread. Would like to hear your opinions.
    ----

    You are right in your analysis, but fail to see the existential threat virtualization (not necessarily VMW) is to the windows OS.
    Check out what BEA is doing with the liquid VM these days, and what Just Enough OS is. It was explained to me in words I can understand, and what I got from it is that some people out there are getting rid of the operating systems, running just very small parts of those, and the rest is done by VMware's products.

    This, in other words, means that 5-10 years down the road, applications will run on the VMware operating system without Linux or Windows in between. For MS, all that will be left is the applications like Office, which was always the case, but we were always pulled into those by the windows platform. If windows disappears, lots of us might pick any other word processor, or spread sheet, etc.

    Windows disappearing, hard for us to even imagine having used it for 20 years. For lots of kids out there, windows is the computer.
    None the less, it's starting to happen these days, you less and less need windows to run any application.

    This is not some minor threat to MS, or competition over some market, it's a crucial fight for that company (Xbox and humongous pile of cash aside)!

    Keep holding ...

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    • the_great_majestic_rawdog,
      are you using another alias?
      where is my vmx config file?

    • keep dreaming, all i see is this stock tank day after day. when you guys gonna do something to get this thing back up? some news, something!! or is all you got is posting on this site?

    • the_great_majestic_rawdog the_great_majestic_rawdog Mar 17, 2008 11:03 AM Flag

      How much you ask???

      Microsoft is offering unlimited free OS and SQL licenses for virtuals running on Windows Data Center Edition. Buy one Data Center license and one SQL enterprise license run as many virtuals you can on the hardware with no editional OS or SQL licenses.


      You have to pay for an OS license and SQL license for EVERY virtual you run on STUPID VMWARE!!

      VMWARE to get crushed.

    • I have never fully understood why MS would care about VMware and I somewhat disagree with the original poster of this thread.
      VMWares bread and butter is in its SERVER virtualization products. Microsoft right now with its news Server 2008 launch is including a free "hypervisor" the basic piece that runs underneath an operating system to allow virtual machines.
      I have always believe that Virtualization will be good for Microsoft. As a customer wants to virtualize a server into multiple servers using Microsofts operating system they need to buy more expensive Microsoft licenses which allow for certain numbers of virtual machines. So instead of buying Windows Server 2008 standard companies will have to buy Windows Server Enterprise (allows 4 virtuals instances of the OS) or Windows Server Datacenter (unlimite virtual instances).
      Listen, Microsoft already does this with Citrix. If someone wants to use the citrix product they still need to buy an underlying Microsoft product called terminal services. There would be little reason, in my opinion, for Microsoft to get rid of Citrix. Which is why I don't really know how important this VMware vs Microsoft battle will be.
      But I do know that Microsoft does want to own the entire desktop and server stack and allow companies, whether by using free software, to do that.

      • 1 Reply to avanraal
      • No wonder you're confused, you don't understand a thing.
        VMware's ESX is a thin hypervisor that allows you to build multiple virtual servers on a single physical server. P.S. MS doesn't get much out of licensing, b/c you pay per host CPU core, so if you have 20 Windows Server 2003 operating systems running in 20 little virtaul servers on a single physical server that has 2 quad core Intel Xeon processors, guess what, MS only gets licensing for those 8 cores (that's 4x2). More over, MS doesn't own Citrix, and together, they don't do the same thing, plus Citrix is crap... MAtter of fact, Citrix just bought another hypervisor company, Xen, which is open source, but I don't want to confuse you so we won't get into that.
        Citrix and Terminal Services only serve up application instances and are limited by the underlying OS, ie MS Windows (aka total crap), so there is no comparison there. Where there is a comparison, or so MS and dumpers/bashers think (idiots) is where MS is trying to climb on to the hypervisor bandwagon (wow, talk about late comers, 12 yrs. late) with there total crap of a product Virtual Server and Hyper-V or whatever. You think pricing it @ $26 or $28 is gonna be a spite to VMware? Um, well let me see the list of supported OS's they can handle? Oh, wait, how you gonna manage all that virtual infrastrucutre? Have you ever worked with anything MS does in the infrastructure management arena, wow talk about dogged... They, nor Oracle, nor Citrix can or will catch up, bottom line. Not with M&As, not with R&D, it's over, and MS oughta watch out for virtaul appliances, cause once you start serving up virtual appliances over the net, the idea of a desktop OS, IT'S DONE, NO MORE MS, BUH-BYE NOW, CYA OFFICE HACK, CYA IE CRAPTASTIC, JUST FOUND TABS, AND CYA VISTA (and whatever you think is coming next)!

        ok, i'm done, buh-bye now...

    • Exactly. Windows is a giant hairball of bloatware with more holes than swisscheese. Why do servers need browsers and other applications loaded on them? All that stuff on a server is just more stuff that can break or be hacked.

      Thin is in.

    • Interesting thoughts. To determine whether Windows is threatened, we need to look at why customers buy Windows in the first place. IMO, it's (relatively) easy to install and administer, inexpensive to obtain, and all the applications run on it. Java can't really say that. Many applications aren't written in Java.
      From experience I know that when I go to develop a new app, I rely on the underlying OS parts like a TCPIP stack, display drivers, etc. The point of writing on Windows is not having to reinvent things like that.

      The problem with Windows is that it comes with way more than you need, much of it written without security in mind. MSFT won't let you remove it either, so your stuck with bloat.
      The optimal solution would be a platform that has everything you need while your developing your app, then let's you package up only the parts you need into the smallest possible package.
      The remaining question is: who will create something like this first. Citrix is certainly working on it. MSFT is probably working on it, since they have plans for the minimal kernel OS without the, well, Windows. VMware is working on Virtual Appliances.
      So it is what it should be: a race to give the customers, developers, and other members of the economic system what they want. I, for one, am eager to see who wins.

      • 1 Reply to johnkenn_95008
      • If you follow this thread up to now we establish that there's a possibility that the virtualization world is bringing the end to Windows, or at least forcing it to change significantly.

        Now, let's leave the tech aside.
        Bringing us back to the MS vs. virtualization issue as a business.

        I am posting these thoughts because a lot of threads on this board (ignoring the pumps and bashes) concentrate on the competition for the virtual market, while I believe inside Microsoft the focus is not merely on putting their foot in that market and making money off of it.

        I believe they are genuinely worried for their OS business!

        This is not Google taking their ad and search money, this is more equivalent to everyone starting to use Google's online apps and ditching MS Office.
        Google moves people away from Office, VMware from the windows OS ... Microsoft is more and more backed up against the wall as a business.
        Now, that's a dragon I wouldn't want to face no matter what company I was.

        This thread is not published to pump the VMW stock, in fact the above might even scare you away from investing in VMware, being that Microsoft is even more intent, for its OS survival, to crush VMware and any other players.

        Keep holding ...

 
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