## Recent

% | \$
 Quotes you view appear here for quick access.

# Cameco Corporation Message Board

• freemarket235 freemarket235 Sep 19, 2009 7:56 PM Flag

## Nulear vs. Solar Land Requirements

I guessimate that a solar power plant
(photovoltaic) would require over 17 square
miles of land in order to produce the same
amount of energy as a 1 Gig (1 GW) nuke or
coal plant. Here are my calculations:

The average amount of solar power that hits
the earth on a sunny, cloudless day is 1.353
kW per square meter. Since it is not
practical to keep the collectors exactly
perpendicular to the incoming rays during the
whole day, let's be generous and say that
every square meter of collector gets hit with
1 KW for eight hours per day, seven days per
week, 52 weeks per year.

Now, assume that the collectors are 20%
efficient which is also very generous. So,
the collectors produce 200 watts per square
meter for 8 hours per day. That amount of
energy is the same as 67 watts for 24 hours.

Therefore, it would take 15 million square
meters of collectors in order to produce
the same energy as a 1 GW nuke plant.

Now, multiply that number by three in order
to make room for all the access roads
required to clean and maintain the
collectors and you get 45 million square
meters of land.

Since one square mile equals 2.6 million
square meters, 45 million square
meters of land equals 17.3 square miles.

QED

SortNewest  |  Oldest  |  Most Replied Expand all replies
• Solar will be/is part of the energy providers long term, as is nuclear. Large scale solar or wind does have environmental impact as well. A couple of major problems with solar and wind is that it is not always available on demnad. Of course we know solar i only available in the day, but on cloudy days it is weak as well. Apparently large scale solar is so subject to variation in output that management of the grid becomes a problem. On a small scale on and off solar contirbutions are not significant, but on large scale the present grid apparently cant handle the fluctuations.

• Yep, management of the gird....Smart Grid, IOW, but we ain't getting any for at least 10 years according to Chu. NIMBY could make this even longer.

As for China and the Europeans, they have places where the wind doesn't blow or the sun isn't out. Effeciency of this stuff is what?
How many installations are out at one time?

Geo and nuclear are there all the time rain, shine, calm.

Solar panels and wind require lots of strategic metals (small quanities per unit, but you have to have large arrays to generate anything meaningful) which do not just appear magically.

• What people cant seem to understand is the magnitude of the problem we face when it comes to energy supply/demand, and growth in demand. If you have a listen to a couple of lectures on the web site mitworld distributed intelligence by both Dr. Nocera and Dr. S. Koonin it puts the problem into perspective. one that has more focus on electrification challenges is "The role of new technologies in a sustainable energy economy" The predicted growth in world wide demand is astounding an does not look like it can be met on the long term with out significant new discoveries.

• U238 is 140 times as abundant as U235 which is used in current reactors. The depleted uranium in the US could power the world for a century. The Uranium in granite could power the world for a million years at a minining cost less per unit of energy than the current cost of coal. Thorium 232 is three times as abundant as U238.
No new technology needed. The reactors cost 50% more than current reactors so no need to start today

• greetings! again? OK:):)
PG&E is installing a 500mw solar thermal plant on 1.09 square miles.
it will run for 100 years, has little security costs, and has zero emissions or waste.. it's cheap.

"The ability to utilize solar thermal technology after the sun sets is made possible by a storage system that is up to 93% efficient, according to Ausraโs executive vice president John OโDonnell.
High efficiency is achieved because solar thermal plants do not need to convert energy to another form in order to store it and do not rely on battery technology. Flat moving recflectors or parabolic mirrors focus solar energy to generate heat. This heat generates steam that turns turbines, thus generating an electric current.
If you want to generate electricity-at, say, 3 am-heat from the sun can be stored for later use. This gives solar thermal technology the ability to not just produce peak power, but also generate base load electricity."

(btw imo the green thing is not a function of special interests or lobbyists. fwiw china is leading the world in wind and solar, whereas over here utes themselves are out-lobbying the enviro advocates \$3:1....http://www.publicintegrity.org/investigations/climate_change/assets/img/climate-change-chart.gif)

do u all see this bull run continuing or ending? it looked toppy on friday. I hope to be out of all non pm-longs by next week. out of pms a little later. do u all think PMs are gonna be the next bubble or just have a run to 1200 gold, then fall apart in may?
gl freemarket man, and everyone!

• 3 Replies to sthbnkrd
• "The ability to utilize solar thermal technology after the sun sets is made possible by a storage system that is up to 93% efficient,"

Oh, Really? Does it turn lead into gold, also? Gee, I wish, I had a 93% heat storage unit after 10 hours. And the days of little or reduced sun? And how effecient is this heat storage device in actaul engineering application? Good luck.

OBW the reflector are self cleaning aren't they?

Why are utes out lobbying envirnomentalists? They what uncle sap to pick up the costs! Especially if the cap and trade tax comes in.

• <<<<do u all see this bull run continuing or ending? it looked toppy on friday>>>>

---<g>, Lol... Are you BS'ing me? Don;t you see the S&P500 "bear wedge" this market's climbing? Don't you see the "topping signals" repeating themselves over & over again, people buying the **bear ETF's** and having their asses handed to them over & over again?

Wake up! This run's not over!! Suck-it-up, stand proud & make money as a long!

smoot

• "PG&E is installing a 500mw solar thermal
plant on 1.09 square miles."

sth -- I was expecting you. :)
Have you noticed that these solar plants
NEVER mention their energy output?

Here is another number that may shock you.

http://zebu.uoregon.edu/1998/ph162/l4.html

"How much energy from the sun reaches the
surface of the Earth on Average?

Average over the entire earth = 164 Watts per
square meter over a 24 hour day."

Now, when you consider the 10% efficiency
of solar cells, you only get 16 watts per
square meter over a 24 hour day.

I am still waiting for the U stampede. My
account needs a 50% increase just to break
even for the last two years.

• <<<<Now, assume that the collectors are 20%
efficient which is also very generous. So,
the collectors produce 200 watts per square
meter for 8 hours per day>>>>

----You are OVERLY OUTRAGIOUSLY generous to a fault! Where in the U.S. do we get 8hrs of continous sunshine in a day? Ans. is very few places, IMO. Anyway your point is well taken BUT you fail to recognize this is a POLITICAL answer to the energy problem, & not a practical one.

---Think politics, think solar, think green, think small, think insulation, think geothermal, think wind power, think politics!

• No, no, no, you don't get it. All those ants out there installing solar why it just puts all those unemployed worker back to work. It's like the modern Hoover Dam! Green Jobs!
The ANSWER! That's why we needed visionaries like Van Jones even though he had slightly more problems than the Sec of the Treasury.

Gad, we will never get green jobs going if you keep bring up nuclear. Please go away.

• Here are a few more numbers that I hope
will shock the public.

"A 1,000-MW solar conversion plant, for
example โ the same size as I've been using
for the comparisons of coal and nuclear โ
would cover 50 to 100 square miles with
35,000 tons of aluminum, two million tons of
concrete, 7,500 tons of copper, 600,000 tons
of steel, 75,000 tons of glass, and 1,500
tons of other metals such as chromium and
titanium โ a thousand times the material
needed to construct a nuclear plant of the
same capacity. These materials are not cheap,
and real estate doesn't come for nothing.