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Vringo, Inc. Message Board

  • mflaherty4204 mflaherty4204 Jan 29, 2013 12:26 PM Flag

    1000 shares of VRNG or 100 Shares of VHC....which would you rather have right now??

    I've been long on VHC for over 2yrs and have 2050 shares....

    I've been long on VRNG since last May and have 10000 shares....

    Thinking of dumping 5000 shares of VRNG and buying more VHC, since I think VRNG is dead money for the next few weeks (or months) until final motions are finally filed, responded to by both sides, and the Judge finally pulls the trigger against Google.

    Final decisions by the judge in VHC are due within 3 weeks....

    Hoping to hit the VHC pop, and then buy back into VRNG since i know the shorts will be raiding this until the bitter end....

    Thoughts??? What would you do??

    I appreciate everyone's advice and comments.


    Sentiment: Hold

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    • mflaherty4204,

      I might have an option not yet mentioned. If you believe in VRNG for the long term, just even 6 months to a year from now, VRNG warrants could be an option to consider.

      VRNG-WT are about $1.30, or about 2 1/2 times less expensive than VRNG shares.

      Strat might be the following:

      Sell 1/2 you VRNG shares
      Next purchase about the same number os shares, just as warrents at 1.30.
      Next, use the remaining cash to buy back into VHC allowing a quick trade if VHC runs on your anticipated ruling.

      If VRNG runs in the next 6 months, you will be able to cash out is VRNG-WT if VRNG goes above the $5 warrant level. If not you could then convert warrants back to shares and continue the trading, as that trading is what you are attempting to do.

      Lock up the warrants for VRNG, allow the cash for the VHC trade. Just an option that alows you to cover both VRNG and VHC, jmo flip

      • 1 Reply to philipswallowflip
      • Phil,

        I really appreciate your opinion and taking the time to post your suggestion While I consider myself a educated investor, I am also a very simple one.... I've only executed Long and Short trades in my time (I can count on 1 hand how many stocks I've shorted....)

        I've never gotten into the more sophisticated trades like warrants, options, puts/calls, etc......mainly because I have never taken the time to learn how they work, therefore I have no idea what the pros and cons are, rules of engagment, and even how to execute these trades.... (Can I do them via my Scottrade Acct??)

        I've read so many articles on IV and SA about VRNG onver the last year trying to do my DD, and others have posted that using a strategy with buying warrants CAN be a more lucrative method than just buying common stock and staying LONG. However, I'd have to assume there is more downside risk as well correct???

        If you could shed some light to a hypothetical example of if I sold say, 4,000 VRNG shares via Scottrade tomorrow, @ $3.20 which converts to $12,800. I then buy 4000 Warrants VRNG/WS (I checked on Scottrade as I was writing this) @ $1.33 for $5,320. The other 7500 i put into VHC for about 200 shares...

        If I hypothetically did this, what is my downside risk with the warrants?? When do they expire, when do I have to convert, how do I convert and to what, etc. ??? What timeline/constraints am I working with/against?

        If the stock hypothetically hits say $5.33, and I decide to "cash out", do I then make a premium of $4 x 4000 warrants for a profit of $16,000 - $5320 for a net profit of $10,680??, or is a net $16,000 gain?

        If the stock tanks to $2.00, then what...?

        Sorry for all the elementary questions, but as you can tell I don't know #$%$ about method of trading warrants, but realize it could be a great fit for the strategy I'm trying to implement.....

        If you could enlighten me to your knowledge on the above hypothetical example, I'd greatly appreciate it.....(or just tell me to go to a Scottrade office i guess....hahaha)

        Thanks for your time.


    • I've made my choice already. vrng long and strong!

    • Its not about where it is right now...Its where it can be

      VHC is 35.20 right now...and in three months....may be 40
      VRNG is 3.20 right now...and in three months....may be 25


      Sentiment: Strong Buy

      • 2 Replies to hai_vamsi
      • Hai,

        I totally agree with you logic with "not where is it now, but where in can be...."


        with all the articles I've read and DD, VHC is 35 and Judge Davis's final decision based upon the favorable jury award against Apple is due by mid-Feb......VHC can pop to anywhere between $45-$60 after that and once Cisco potentially settles, some say $100 but that's wishful thinking to a certain degree and at least 6-18 months away with appeals, etc. factored in...

        While I am long VRNG and believe at some point it will be a winner, Judge Jackson continues to drag his feet, final decisions won't be until mid-March to April IMHO, and then I'm sure GOOG appeals dragging it out longer....hence I think it's dead money for the next 2-3 months trading between $3-$3,50, especially with all the shorts raiding it daily and the MM playing the manipulation game.... at best it gets up to $6-8 this year with a favorable decision by Judge Jackson...$25 is a pipe dream my friend unless you are long until 2015+...

        That's why I'm considering selling 1/2 my VRNG stake here, putting in VHC, hitting that pop, then buying back in to VRNG close to final decisions once all these freaking final motions are done being filed, countered, etc.

        I'm not pro, but I like to believe my logic has some common sense....thoughts??

      • don't be fooled by the slow activity, 70,000 shares are wanted @ 3.19

        Sentiment: Strong Buy

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