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ImmunoGen, Inc. Message Board

  • jv08201 jv08201 Jul 13, 2006 8:09 PM Flag

    Possible stroke of luck?


    Just wondering why BIOTEST came to IMGN to make this deal.
    According to linked article, antibody comes with some mighty fine attributes, like:
    Possibly a NEW mechanism of action for the therapy of multiple myeloma, inclusive of any/all present clinical compounds.
    In pre-clinic, destruction of malignant myeloma cells with a high degree of effectiveness and speed.

    Surprised (and very happy) that IMGN has option to buy in as full partner for distribution in USA. Haven�t been able to locate if BIO.F will run a naked antibody trial ala Herceptin with molecule.

    Conjugated with DMx and proper linker, who knows? Good work Mitch!!!

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    • of course it could be by then, ski mentioned it could have been pre-clinical before the license was taken...i think 2704 and bivatuzamab are instances of that...just wanted to make the further point that a naked trial is a probability...and we ain't part of it...

      but we're very interested...mabs that disrupt the growth of cancers apparently have a way of eluding the defenses that our conjugates have had to address...very interested in tras/dm1 for that reason...

      in reading those press releases, another statement that tickles is that this partnership has strengthened biotests patent rights to the target...i don't understand that...


    • JV,

      A sense of urgence wouldn't matter if IMGN only let them go so far preclinically, they still may have a lot to do.

      One thing I'm reasonably certain IMGN wouldn't support is animal safety trials before a license. This alone can take many months. I suspect your WAG may be far to optimistic.


    • JV,

      I don't believe IMGN has exacting standards that say how far a potential partner can go preclinically before they license a drug. I think it's a little different in a multi drug partnership, there a point may be established when an established partner has to make a decision.

      Years ago I remember Mitch discussing providing potential partners with drugs, as I remember it, he indicated in some cases they had years to work with them. He also indicated that to date all had either licensed, or were still working with the drug.

      I don't know if it's still true that no one who was provided drug walked away. One thing I believe is that before a potential partner gets to try a conjugate, IMGN has tried it and at least has some indication of what it does preclinically.


    • my memory is poor...there may be multiple errors in what follows...

      my take on all this is that the immunogen collaboration will have nothing to do with the naked antibody trial that is scheduled to go forward...i got this from carol...that immunogen was not involved; not that the trial was going forward...

      in other words the tap will not be used initially with bt-062...that mab, like herceptin, and rituxin, are effective 'naked' biotest could have an idea for a bt-062 conjugate in the wings as dna has done with tras/dm1...

      is that clear?...


      • 2 Replies to patienc28e
      • i want to make a point about immunogen's pipeline that i won't let gary get by with...i just re-read this and in places it sounds like i know what i'm talking about...don't be fooled...

        i asked carol sometime back about these collaborations, and licenses...she was clear that a 'license' is explicit evidence that the company in question has a funded project underway evaluating a tap to a unique target...actually i got this email from her sometime back on that subject...

        "A partner takes a license for an antigen target. For example, Genentech has
        the exclusive right to use our maytansinoid TAP technology with any antibody
        that targets HER2.

        A key reason that we agree to outlicense our TAP technology to another
        company for use with a given target is because that other company has a
        patent position that prevents us from developing our own TAP compound to that
        particular target.

        Most of our licenses provide the other company with the right to use any of
        our maytansinoid agents (e.g., DM1, DM4) with antibodies to their target. For
        example, Millennium has rights to use any of our maytansinoid agents with
        antibodies to PSMA."

        i called her later and that's when she explained that each of the licenses were projects that were sold internally by company scientists and totally funded...immunogen normally gets $1 million for each of them...

        this is more than the sales tactic of immunogen, in a collaboration, making conjugates for partners to test in an unstructured program...once a scientist says 'yes, i want to put this one through a pre-clinical trial'...then the interested scientists must sell the idea to their bosses and the company must fund the project and take out a license for that target and from then on the project is structured according to fda guidelines...

        so what i'm saying...all those companies listed in the immunogen pipeline as being in preclinical...are in preclinical and could pop out of there at any time...remember it takes at best 18 months to weave thru the steps...but there you have it...

    • The biotech industry is a VERY close knit group, especially the scientists. Follow them from company to company and you will see our partners being lined up as well over time.

      It wouldn't surprise me a bit to find out that BI recommended IMGN's technology to Biotest.

      After all, BI worked with us for a while in trials, before they figured out the antibody target they had was also found in skin cells. According to BI, they were perfectly happy with the conjugate's performance, just not with the skin reaction, as far as I understand it.



    • "Haven�t been able to locate if BIO.F will run a naked antibody trial ala Herceptin with molecule."

      Is it possible that Biotest has already run in vivo test with the DMx conjugate and has seen superior results over the standalone antibody?


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