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Axion Power International Inc. Message Board

  • strangerthingshavehappenedzbop2 strangerthingshavehappenedzbop2 Nov 27, 2012 12:59 PM Flag

    Understand the Axion Exide Break up .

    As most are aware the DOE apparently awarded Axion and Exide a "joint" 34 million award in 2009.

    As I understand, overtime it appears, Axion did not get One penny of the award, and in effect, has walked away from the agreement and relationship. Reading here and the saseekingalpha board, I think all agree that occurred so I believe it correct.

    I see many "writings" or "suggestions" on the saseekingalpha board, on how this was the "right thing to do" for Axion. For example John Petersen writes in part recently "The lawyer in me is almost certain that Exide's counsel told them they couldn't share without getting a pound of flesh in return. Were I in that position that's the advice I would have given too. Putting on my Axion hat, I can certainly understand why TG would have balked at the prospect of giving Exide anything else."

    "Balked" ? John's writing seems to presuppose that the parties had NO agreement before
    applying for the grant, that the parties had no understanding of who would do what,
    or who was responsible for what before applying for the grant.

    Who just "balks" on an agreement, that is Breach of Contract and you can be sued.

    To believe so or to believe John's submission, I think you have to believe
    Axion had no agreement, no firm understanding, Before applying for the grant.
    To believe that, I think you would have to think Axion management Wholly incompetent,
    a group of fools, and perhaps a violation of their fiduciary duty to the company.

    No I think John absolutely wrong (once again) in his implication or inference.

    I believe the only fair supposition is, before being awarded the grant,
    Axion management did their job, there was a
    written agreement on the grant, the responsibilities, and the split. I cannot imagine
    any responsible managment would ignore something like this.

    So -- how is it then that Exide kept what appears to be the Entire monies ?

    How is it that Axion apparently walked or as John says "balked" without getting One Penny ?

    Frankly how is it that the grant was not returned to the DOE ?

    I can only imagine that Axion did not keep their part of the bargain,
    and Exide let them out since Exide got the benefit of the 34 million,
    and Exide moved ahead with the Exide carbon lead battery.

    Any way you slice it, it appears to be a Very Large Fail for Axion.
    On a joint grant you would imagine, or I would, they were entitled to the
    benefits of at least 17 million (1/2) of the grant, if the two decided to part ways.
    Or at least say 10 million (1/3) ?

    That Axion walked or balked without One Penny,
    that Exide got the full 34 million and used it to create the Exide carbon battery
    Wow, we may not know what occurred, but the result seems to indicate
    a huge fail for Axion.

    Trying to put a positive spin on the Axion Exide agreement and Breaking of agreement
    wherein Axion received not one penny of a 34 million joint grant

    seems like putting a positive spin on bankruptcy,
    well you have no money, and your out of business, and your corp is being sold
    but at least you walked away with no debt.

    Yes it appears axion walked away without owing anything to Exide

    but it appears Exide got the full 34 million AND made their own Exide lead carbon battery.

    If anyone can explain, or wants to guess, on why Axion got $ 0. while Exide got 34 Million
    Please do. If I misunderstood something I certainly would like to hear clarification.

    Well thats how I understand it, and if anything is wrong or misinterpreted I hope someone
    will clarify. Of course these posts are all simply opinion, and speculation, on a message
    board filled with opinion and speculation. Obviously not stock advice.

    GLTA I hope you all do well with your decisions to invest or not to, of course
    each individual should make their own decision with the assistance of their financial

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    • strangerthingshavehappenedzbop2 strangerthingshavehappenedzbop2 Nov 27, 2012 1:34 PM Flag

      I quickly followup for
      It is funny to me because John Petersen actually seems to blame the DOE.

      John Petersen writes (on saseekingalpha)

      "If I wanted to lay "blame" anywhere, it would be with the DOE which blithely awarded $34 million to "Exide with Axion" and assumed that two publicly held companies could just play nice like pre-schoolers in a sandbox and share the money fairly."

      Again, I opine, to believe John Petersen position, it is the DOE fault,
      One must believe that Axion applied for a grant with no managment discussion or
      agreement in place with Exide, on who would do what and who would be responsible for what

      And that Axion actually got a 34 Million grant with no agreement in place.

      Seems quite naive.
      I cannot blame the DOE for something that would be done I imagine
      in the ordinary course of business.
      Does anyone really believe the DOE responsible ?

      Is it the DOE position to tell Axion and Exide how to split the monies ?
      Should the DOE dictate how to share testing, how to build a shared product ?
      Or is that something any responsible party would have in place ?

      I also find it quite indicative of the power of Axion PATENTS.
      Seems Exide built what they wanted with the grant money and no
      concern on Axion patents. Time seems to have proven Exide got
      all the money and used it to build their own Carbon Lead "enhanced" battery.

      An Exide battery which by the way is now for sale and is commercially produced,
      whilst the Axion battery is no where near commercial production or sale ?

      I feel blaming the DOE is naive.
      That this is something Axion management should have had in place.

      I also feel Axion Management had to have had an agreement in place (who wouldn't)
      so there must have been some other fail for Axion to walk without a penny.
      But of course, pure speculation, no proof, only the two companies appear to know.
      Well just conversation and speculation. Certainly for amusement.

      • 1 Reply to strangerthingshavehappenedzbop2
      • arjohnson1963 Nov 27, 2012 6:15 PM Flag

        As I would like to know about what happened between the two, I can only you have. But the way I see it is one of 3 things happened:
        1. Axion is a complete fraud, as seems to be what the trolls here insinuate.
        2. When the grant showed up Axion did not keep their part of the already signed agreement, as you indicate.
        3. When the grant shows up Exide did not keep their part of the agreement and Axion walked.

        Number 1, does not seem likely as if Axion were just conning Exide, East Penn, DOE, BMW, ETC. they would have given in to get money. This did not happen.
        Number 2, seems unlikely to me as well because the agreement they had with Exide was part of the development plan the company had laid out.
        Number 3, seems the most likely as Exide wanted more control of the technology and had the grant money that they could use to muscle little Axion, and Axion walk. Also knowing how slow governments get things done, I can only imagine what Exide did when they got a check for $34m to develop a product that Axion was already making...

        Sentiment: Buy

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