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  • MarknMT MarknMT Oct 29, 2003 7:14 PM Flag

    Amish-Mennonites &c

    Funny, Prez. i've often felt that in many ways the "simple" sects such as the Amish, Quakers, Mennnonites, and so on, have captured a quality of life that we all need. I probably romanticize it, but in many ways I'd love the life, I think. I'm glad they're able to draw that line in the sand and have "quieter" reflective tape.

    Some of the radical Islamic thinking is based on a "return to nature" sentiment that I can identify with. There's a line of thought that argues that in the modern world we cannot take time to participate in the natural world, and the resulting alienation is spiritually devastating.

    Well, I relate to that. I know that when I come back from my week in the mountains the world is going to seem awfully discordant and harsh.

    Which reminds me- aincha sorry you aren't joining us? I am.

    :-)M

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    • Hi MarknMT,

      If you want to read more about the Amish this is a very good book:

      Our Amish Neighbors
      by William Ildephonse Schreiber, William Schrieber, Sybil Gould (Illustrator)
      http: //www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0226740358/qid=1067508474/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-8870572-7586242?v=glance&s=books#product-details

      The author was a German professor at the College of Wooster, Wooster, Ohio, back in the late 1960s when I went to college. Our German professor (Baldwin-Wallace College, Berea, Ohio) arranged a one day bus tour of the Amish hosted by Professor Schreiber. We toured the countryside around Sugercreek, visited a cheese factory, buggy works and had lunch at an Amish farm house. I was so enamored of their lifestyle that I bought his book as a Christmas present to myself in 1969.

      Unfortunately, there is a dark side to their way of life that is detailed chapter 4, pages 97 - 117.

      The "problem" is detailed below, which is taken in large part from that book. Sad, really sad.

      Ostracism on Trial: The Limits of Individual Rights
      http: //www.gruterinstitute.org/publications/ostracism.html

      Jump down to the following section:
      MEIDUNG AMONG THE OLD ORDER AMISH

      THE CASE

      On March 24, 1947, Andy J. Yoder filed a civil suit in the Common Pleas Court in Wooster, Ohio, asking $40,000 damages and a court injunction against Ostracism perpetuated against him by representatives of the Old Order Amish Church to which he had previously belonged. Ostracism or �Meidung� as practiced by the Old Order Amish is a Commandment of the church going back to the year 1632, when Article 17 of the Dortrecht Confession of Faith established this means of disciplining church members.

      The plaintiff, 33 years old, father of seven children, was represented by two attorneys. The local newspaper (Wooster Daily Record) described him during the trial as frail and pale, but speaking with a distinct clear voice. �His manner showed signs of ostracism which made him feel like a �whipped dog.�� 3 Andy Yoder explained the reason for his action: his daughter Lizzie was one year old in 1942 when he purchased a car and as a consequence was shunned. Due to some physical ailment, originally attributed to poliomyelitis, Lizzie needed prolonged medical treatment twice a week in Wooster, approximately 15 miles away from the farm on which the Yoders lived. Fearing the consequences that might arise from the purchase of the car, a 1937 Chevrolet, Yoder had left the church and joined another more liberal one. The plaintiff explained to the court that he had filed suit because he saw no other way to assure the survival of himself and his family. �Meidung,� so he explained, meant �slow death� in the rural setting in which he, a farmer, lived.

      ... more ...

      jad

    • Mark wrote:

      "Funny, Prez. i've often felt that in many ways the "simple" sects such as the Amish, Quakers, Mennnonites, and so on, have captured a quality of life that we all need. I probably romanticize it, but in many ways I'd love the life, I think. I'm glad they're able to draw that line in the sand and have "quieter" reflective tape."

      You may be glad that they are drawing a line in the sand about the reflective tape buy you don't have to deal with them on the roads. It is a public hazard, not only to the buggy riders but auto drivers as well. Gray tape is not going to be seen as well as orange triangles, leading to many more traffic accidents and fatalities. I'm all for freedom of religion, but not at the expense of other people's saftey.

      • 1 Reply to ES250
      • >>you don't have to deal with them on
        the roads. It is a public hazard, not only
        to the buggy riders but auto drivers as
        well. Gray tape is not going to be seen
        as well as orange triangles,<<

        Yeah, I hear that. I won't deny I'm romanticising it.

        But I can't say "they" don't have my sympathies, either, however irrational that may be.

        Thanks for your response. Needed to be said.

        Best of luck,

        Mark

    • Yes,I really enjoyed the times I spent a few days in Lancaster, Pa. There's something special about the Amish lifestyle that many others have lost. Simplicity. Community. Honesty. Stability. I have also noticed (very limited experience) the nice character of children of Jehovah's Witness families, and contrasted that picture with the degrading MTV culture most American youths have inflicted on them. Individuals in stable, closely knit support groups, family size to larger communities, have a huge advantage over those who are basically on their own. Not endorsements --just a few comments.

    • Good Morning, Mark!

      Ain't them Amish folks strange? I mean, hey, they don't send their kids to school past the 8th grade. None of them have a "job". They each do according to his own abilities. They don't pay social security. They refuse to fight in our wars. They isolate themsselves. They use no electricity or new-fangled gadgets. They wear boring clothes and refuse to even drive a car or truck.

      Man, they are weird.

      Every senior among them is well taken care of, they have virtually no crime whatsoever, they have no unemployment, they live a simple peaceful life centered on their families and their religion. They respect one another and take care of one another. And everyone wishes they could join the Amish.

      Wait a second.... I forget... who's the weird ones, them or us? ;-)

      Well, nevermind. I need a faster computer and internet connection, or else my life is ruined. hehehe.

      Worst of luck to the wapiti! Their luck would be MUCH better if old "Mr. Makes Too Damn Much Noise" here isn't there.

      • 1 Reply to prez_geo_w_bush
      • And I completely forgot to post what I originally wanted to say.

        Doesn't it seem totally retarded that if we don't send our kids to school past the 8th grade, that we would have HUGE unemployment and our future would be bleak?

        I wonder why that basic law of economic nature doesn't apply to the Amish? Could Greenspan run THEIR economy into the ground, too, if given the chance?

    • Well, I relate to that. I know that when I come back from my week in the mountains the world is going to seem awfully discordant and harsh---

      Gee Mark, when I come back from camping a week in the mountains, I head straight for the nearest Starbucks, kiss the soft carpeted ground, suck down a bunch of hot steamy caffine, and cry from sheer happiness at rediscovering working toilets and faucets:-) But then again, I am just a city weenie:-) Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

    • Good luck in the mountains.
      Remember wapiti are heavy.
      Drag downhill or not at all;).
      Save me some for my week in the mountains.

 
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