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  • ricky18201 ricky18201 Nov 30, 2012 9:15 AM Flag

    Norquist Popular With Lib. Democrats

    At this point the fiscal cliff negotiations are all politics. Democrats have proposed the revenue increases (which are very popular), but neither side wants to be the one that proposes cuts. This has been the Republican problem all along--they talk the talk but when it's time to get down to the business of making cuts, they don't walk the walk. Heck, they spent the campaign accusing Obama of cutting Medicare.

    Well, now they've really backed themselves into a corner. They banked everything on making Obama a one term president. The Democrats are coming off a 2nd win that has serious implications for the electoral college maps (many of those purple states are now decidedly blue). The revenue increases are coming. Republicans are divided. And they're being faced with the spectre of either not being able to come up with the solid spending cut proposals they have repeatedly demanded or being the ones who cut Medicare, which they have also repeatedly demanded.

    That's why I laughed at winholder when he was complaining about "Congress" never actually dealing with fiscal concerns. Well, now they are. And we see who is walking the walk. It's the ones who found both the spending cuts and the revenue to maintain Medicare.

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    • Thus far there has been very little walking the walk, just a lot of threats, name-calling, and wasting of time...kind of like this message board. In Congress neither side has done much of anything yet nor neither has Obama outside of participating in the name-calling and threats. He thinks he doesn't have to negotiate because he won and he will go on another campaign tour to convince the American people he is right. It makes little difference if he is right or wrong (which I think he is) because Congress, particularly those up for reelection in two years, will have to make the call.

      The tax laws are a convoluted, corrupt mess. Who wrote them?

      The housing and banking industry hit a wall a few years ago. Who wrote the laws that changed their processes that lead to the fiasco that started many of our problems?

      Medicare, Social Security has been in danger of falling apart for decades now. Who wrote the laws that dictate how they operate and are they are funded? Who has ignored calls from nearly everyone that something needs to be done?

      The answer to these and many other questions around our financial difficulties is of course CONGRESS!

      Politics and not the needs or the future of this country will lead to the decision made over this current fiasco and that will not lead to the best outcome for the taxpayers.

      Wanna bet they go home for yet another recess before they reach agreement?

      • 1 Reply to winholder
      • "Thus far there has been very little walking the walk"

        Are you kidding? Obama has been making the same concrete revenue proposals related to the Bush tax cuts for four years now. They are going to walk on January 1st no matter what. If Republicans want spending cuts to go along with that, or to close loopholes instead, they need to come up with a proposal.

        Go on another "I hate Congress" rant if it helps you sleep at night, but realize you've got your head in the sand.

    • "That's why I laughed at winholder when he was complaining about "Congress" never actually dealing with fiscal concerns. Well, now they are."

      Your humor is sick if that made you laugh. Congress is still not working on this problem. The Republicans are making offers in the media; Obama is refusing them in the media, meaning neither side has likely put much effort into understanding the other. When was the last time you heard anything from Dirty Harry or Nut Job Nancy? How are they involved in any decisions? Zero.

      This is Obama saying I am going to win regardless of what you want and making his case in the media instead of doing and honest job of negotiating or listening. He certainly isn't leading; he is only posturing and posing.

      You may call it an anti-Congress rant, but tell me, what actions has Congress taken in the past 6-8 years that have had a positive impact on this county's economy or economy?

      He is the one blocking. He continually says that unless I get the tax increases I want, I will take the ball and go home. That is his idea of bi-partisanship…I win, you lose.

      If the MSM would ever grow a pair and tell the truth or even look for the truth, we might have a different situation.

      • 2 Replies to winholder
      • "You may call it an anti-Congress rant, but tell me, what actions has Congress taken in the past 6-8 years that have had a positive impact on this county's economy or economy?"

        I'll repeat:

        Blame Democrats for tea party stonewalling all you want. The nation knows the Party of No.

        And look in the mirror, winholder. You know what Congress has done in the past four years. From the ARRA to health reform to Dodd-Frank, the legislation that has been passed--almost completely without Republican cooperation--has been far-reaching and historic. You're just upset because you don't want Obama or Congress to accomplish anything unless Republicans can take credit.

      • Actually I think alot more work is being done than you realize. There is alot of testing the waters in the media. For instance, Republicans ran the idea of holding up nominations as a bargaining chip with the whole Susan Rice thing, but it didn't play very well. They're starting to run their next bargaining chip--holding up the debt ceiling--through the media wringer, but that didn't work out for them last time. And they are running their different ideas through the media gamut as well.

        Unfortunately for Republicans, they just don't have much left to bargain with. But Boehner seems to be methodically attempting to exercise what he does have left. Part of this is learning about how the public may react to these chips, part of this is showing the base and reluctant members that they've used all the chips available. My main worry is that many of the Tea Brain members went back to gerrymandered districts over TG and found a base that hasn't learned a thing.

        Eventually though Republicans are going to actually have to name their demands publicly. I imagine that outside of the media spotlight, much of the work on a deal has already been done. Going over the fiscal cliff would be the last straw for the Republican party. The party may split permanently if they do. And I think they know that.

    • 'This has been the Republican problem all along--they talk the talk but when it's time to get down to the business of making cuts, they don't walk the walk.'

      Then why don't the Democrats walk the walk, show some leadership, and propose the cuts? Are they too afraid to do anything when the economy is still tanking with an election just two years away? If the Democrats have the knowledge to solve the financial problems of the century, why aren't they taking the lead? Propose the fearful cuts and begin a negotiation over a final list, just claiming that they want stuff but it has to be our stuff is not showing leadership or negotiation, but an extreme dictatorial attitude. Harry Reid couldn't lead a parade of ants to a picnic let along the Senate.

      Even Little Timmy was waffling and saying they could get this done if the Republicans would just roll over and do what we want.

      • 1 Reply to pinhighshot
      • "Then why don't the Democrats walk the walk,"

        As I noted, the Democrats have made concrete proposals regarding the specific tax rates they want. The Republicans have come back with ANOTHER demand for closing loopholes and spending cuts, without actually naming the loopholes they want closed and the spending cuts they want.

        At some point, they have to name the loopholes and the spending they want cut. They have never done this, even when they were in control of Congress and the Presidency for six years.

 
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