Just wait and see. The loss will be between
$3-$500 million. I am not trying to negative about this
stock. I own shares. Harold and company are getting all
the dirt out as soon as possible.
I am sorry
if you did not get this information at work today.
It maybe another case of them not revealing ALL the
I'm new to this board so I'm really not familiar
with all the complaining and griping. I'd like to have
a serious discussion on the issues that face the
company and to exchange some true info and not just
heresay and gossip.
As someone who is very
familiar with the company, I want to take a poll: how many
of you actually work at the company and
You don't have to give your identities away, I just
want to get a lay of the land. Also, how many of you
are stockholders? Do we have any executives on
The stock will take a beating for some time, but so
are all of the other financial services stocks on the
market. It will be at least 2 more years before we can
dream of hitting 50. It will take 8 strong quarters of
growth for the stock to reach that level. If you are in
for the long haul, you should be ok. If your in for
the short term, don't get your hopes up.
Sorry, everybody. I didn't mean to post the same
message twice. I didn't think the first one went
Good luck to all with your investment in this company.
We all deserve some luck as well as superior senior
management. God know we sure don't have the later, but maybe
we can have the former.
I am not discouraged from posting my ideas. It is
just that I have said all I can say about Harold
Chandler, his failure to grow sales, and the effect that
will have on the long-term prospects for UP. I am sure
the board doesn't need to hear any more of it from
You mentioned that if I were successful in achieving
an objective of contributing to Chandler's ouster,
that it would be "at the expense of another man."
True. True. And nothing would delight me more than to
have contributed in some small way to this guy's
Remember something as this story
unfolds. If what I have said about Chandler is not
accurate, nothing I have said is going to hurt him. If what
I have said IS accurate, then I still say nothing I
have said will have hurt him. What will have hurt him
is what he has DONE, not what I have SAID. His
insurance career and reputation have been built on the
backs of and at the expense of his
UNUM, its fine employees, and we shareholders deserve
better than a guy whose only demonstrated, long-term
skill is to merge two companies, and then cut costs to
drive up the stock price. He is a destroyer. He is not
a builder. May his professional death be slow and
agonizing under the crush of law suits launched at him by
producers, brokers, and shareholders. (Just having a little
You haven't discouraged me from commenting on
this board. I just don't think I can add anything new
to what I have already stated, and I don't think
there would be much interest from the board in having
me continue my evaluation of Harold
You made the comment that if I achieved my objective
of exposing Chandler for for the kind of person and
CEO i believe he really is, it would be "at the
expense of another man." True. True. And nothing would
give me greater satisfaction than to have played some
small role in his professional demise.
something. If what I have said about him is inaccurate,
nothing I have said is going to hurt him. If what I have
said is true, any harm done him by what I have said is
harm NOT from what I have SAID, but harm from what he
has DONE in building a career that has been at the
expense of so many other people.
There are CEO's
out there who have Chandler's skills and who are
builders rather than destroyers. UNUM deserves a person
like this, and so do the employees of UNUM and those
of us who have inveted in the company.
your input. We don't agree on a few things. So
what! We both want the company to do well not only
because of our investment there but because we still have
fiends in the company. From your comments it is likely
we worked together at one point in time at PVT, and
in my years there I only worked with one person that
I really didn't like or trust. And since she is
still there, you are not her. I obviously cut a lot of
people a lot of slack. That's my nature because I
believe there are many roads to a desired goal. Mine is
not always the best one.
Anyhow, I'm looking
for good news today too because that is Chandler's
nature. If he delivers bad news, expect it to be highly
softened by the good news of his plans to move ahead. He
is developing his "story" which will be sold to all,
hook, line, and sinker. It has worked in the past.
That's why I expect to it work again.
Tickertocker, while we may not agree on many
things on this board, I think all of us on this board
want the same thing. We would like the stock price to
increase, and the employee working there to be treated
I, also , have not moved up in my professional life
by stepping on someone else. I feel that is the best
way to go through life.
are many others who do not agree with this. It makes
them feel superior to walk over others. Well, that is
their choice. Sooner or later they will get walked on.
Look at Bob Crispin. He came to Unum thinking he was
next in line to replace Jim Orr. Now he he is gone. He
Chandler will get his. It may
not be with UnumProvident, but it will happen.
I hope you stay on this board. You have good
I appreciate your reply and I had no intention to
discourage your expression of ideas. I'm not sure from your
reply whether you are seeking to retaliate against
Chandler for the damage to you and others that you
attribute to him, or if you are on a mission to save others
from the same fate. Either way, that is your right.
However, it appears to me that your achievement of either
objective will finally be "at the expense of another man."
I appreciate your candor, though I might not agree
with your perceptions.
I do have a life, but I can see why you might ask
the question. Even I think I have become excessive.
Time to back off.
To answer your question about
my investment or agenda, I have both, and they are
focused on Chandler. I detest the man and everything he
stands for, and I believe he should be fired. As a
matter of fact, IF the allegation in the class action
suit is accurate---that Chandler and UNUM agreed to a
limited due diligence in their merger negotiations and
did not disclose that fact until after the merger was
completed---I hope he is criminally prosecuted and ends up
counting his millions from a jail cell.
experienced the carnage he has caused in two companies, and I
believe he will do the same with UNUM. He cares nothing
for his employees, and I have seen him destroy the
career of at least 50 capable, dedicated people whom I
know personally, first at Provident and then at Paul
Revere. He does it all in the name of driving up the
stock value of his company. Investors will say that is
his job. But I also believe his ability to inrease
stock value is limited to short term gains, because he
has NEVER demonstrated an ability to grow the top
I think anyone who supports Chandler,
like some on this board, either don't know him like I
do or have a far more selfish agenda than I have. I
believe UP will recover some of its value, certainly, but
it won't reach its full potential until Chandler is
I have achieved many thing in my life that I am
very proud of. I have never, however, achieved a
single thing at the expense of another man or woman. The
same can hardly be said for Mr. Chandler. The sum of
his character, integrity, values, and decency equal
See what happens when you ask that kind of question?
Now, I am out of here for a while.....much to the
delight of Nobody, I am sure.
To tickertocker 2000: It is perhaps none of my
business, but I am curious to note the apparent investment
you have in maintaining frequent, intense and
thoughtful interactions on this board. Do you not have a
life, o is there some agenda that motivates your
notable involvement and passion?