Here comes the juicy bit...who actually did the 'brick' and who wrote about the 'brick'...drama. And can Tesla sue?
"Max Drucker, CEO of Santa Barbara-based Social Intelligence Corp, is a clear plea for assistance in the repair of his car. Drucker identifies his car as Roadster #340, the same car that serves as the primary example in Degusta's piece. Drucker has since spoken with Autopia about his car, admitting that he drove his Roadster down to a 25 percent charge, then left it parked for six weeks, something the owner's manual specifically warns against."
That story continues to evolve, with Degusta now claiming that it was Tesla that leaked the name of Roadster owner #340, Max Drucker,
Speaking as a Double EE, EVERY battery has a BRICKING problem. PERIOD. Your car battery bricks also its just doesn't cost as much to replace. :)
Research 'ground wire' one of the reasons why they have one for all conductor installatios...short circuits occur thats why they have insurance.
Why can' insurance solve that problem..if we can insure an actors legs from ET why not the battery. food for thought.
Noway don't sound so deseperate the more you worry the more closer we are to the POP.
The shorts are living on the edge with one announcement of good news, I like to short compnaies that are pitiful and have no hope in sight.
Not quite fool proof, but then again, neither is changing your oil. However, I can see circumstances where this could be a problem not related to sheer stupidity (e.g., someone unexpectedly has to be away from the car for an extended period of time.)
I do think Tesla undestated their warnings. It's one thing to say sort of vaguely that failure to keep the battery properly charged can damage the battery, when the reality is that failure to keep the battery properly charged could result in killing the battery with a resulting cost of $40k to replace it. Given the magnitude of the cost of replacing the battery, I think Tesla's warnings should be very clear.
sparky, this just proves the old axiom, 'when you hear 2 sides of a story, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle".
Really though, anyone who owns this type vehicle and is stupid enough to let it discharge probably gets what he deserves. If you were going to have any real doubt about your ability to do so, just don't own one.
Thanks, you seem to be one of the more rational posters on a Board known for excessive hyperbole on both sides!
its all about delivery, I cant argue anything for profit expectations. they had their chance with vanadium to have customers crawling to them to get it in products to differentiate it from the rest. it would have put them over 20M/Q by now in my estimation. smith would be all over it and A123 would not even be looked at.
Kanode seems to think the years that they spent on developing the technology and then years developing the product is ok to say thats why they dont have it today. thats all well and good if I knew that 3 years ago when they touted it, they would still have nothing to show for it, I would have sold a long time ago. just keeping it real.
The problem with low margins and Valence is that any small operating profit that they may make gets eaten up by interest expense.
That is why I feel it is very premature for investors to expect any actual profits from the company for the next 4 quarters at least.
Sparky, thank you for that link, quite possibly the most comprehensive article I have seen on the subject.
Interesting that they do not see any major breakthroughs between now and 2020, yet they do expect costs to come down, and some acceptance of electric vehicles in the marketplace.
I am glad that VLNC seems to be more interested in pursuing business in the Truck/Bus/Commercial vehicle markets. Looks like the battle for business in the automotive sector is going to be Dog-eat-Dog, with very low margins, and probably a lot of consolidation of manufacturers.
<<1. T-18650 used by Tesla are commoditized. They are used in laptops, power drills and very cheap.>>
<<2. T-18650 are Cobalt based and flammable. Tesla got around this problem by packdesign, special cooling etc. But this has lead to dead batteries. (see article above)>>
The pack design has nothing to do with the potential "bricking" problem. The bricking problem is due to the fact that the car's electronics place a parasitic load on the batteries, even when the car isn't in use. Things like clocks, odometers, radios, constantly draw power, even when the car is not in use. If the battery is discharged too far, the battery can be permanently damaged. Read more.
<<3. V-18650 are inherently safe and dont need the fancy packaging as Tesla. And dont have the deep discharge issue. I have seen Phosphate batteries are much more resilient to abuse (thermal, electrical, deep discharge).>>
Not true, especially with respect to the deep discharge issue. Segway has the EXACT SAME warranty in its owner's manual about discharging the batteries for the EXACT SAME REASON (Segway's electronics also put a parasitic load on the batteries). Segway Chat board is filled with reports of dead batteries, with many of those attributed to not plugging in the battery.
<<4. As Valence increase volume, their price will go down further.Based on PVI pricing, Valence pricing is ~$600/kWh.>>
Please provide support for your claim that Valence pricing is $600/kWh.
<<5. Tesla batteries have a big consumer, themselves and they are cross-subsidizing.>>
Huh? Have no idea what point you are trying to make here.
That is what I've said the next generation or two of a volt like vehicle, maybe with 80-100 miles on a charge and an on board fuel source to charge the batteries. So you still have not bought any Valence?