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Ventas, Inc. Message Board

  • rockethrust rockethrust Sep 28, 1999 12:48 PM Flag

    I will hang on to these two and

    that is vtr and vcri. And I will be buying more gold "gold" and "asl" for the bumpy economic ride we are about to experience.

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    • Then click on Case Number, then click on Docket.

    • Click on Webpacer then enter Vencor under Search.

    • Here is a list of Bond holders and information on
      VC Bankrupcy from Lexington, KY Herald Leader. May
      have to type link in.

      Partial message below:

      Published Saturday,
      October 2, 1999, in the

      might offer shareholders

      By Janet

      shareholders, left with stock worth only pennies
      now that
      the company is in bankruptcy, could get the

      chance to recover some of their investment.

      Vencor attorney Thomas Moloney said shareholders

      could be given warrants -- a chance to ``buy stock at
      same price they offer it to creditors'' if and
      when new
      stock is issued.

      Louisville-based long-term care provider might use
      such an
      offer ``to provide the company more working

      capital,'' Moloney said.

      Such warrants are also part
      of the package being worked
      out to reduce the
      company's debt by $900 million by
      giving shares to

      The warrants would kick in after the banks get
      back all
      their debt, Moloney said.

      opportunity to purchase new Vencor stock at a lower
      than that offered to regular investors has a value

      ``Warrants have a value whether you
      exercise them or
      not,'' said Stephen A. O'Neil, a
      Hilliard Lyons analyst in
      Louisville. Warrants may be
      sold to someone else, he

      But without
      final details, ``it's hard to say what people

      should think,'' said O'Neil, whose clients include

      Moloney said yesterday that
      the reorganization, which
      could be finalized in
      the next six months, ``is working
      within the same
      framework discussed in court.''

      That plan would
      give 56 percent of the company to the
      banks, 29
      percent to the 500-plus bondholders and the
      15 percent to real estate spinoff Ventas, which

      owns the hospitals and nursing homes that Vencor


      The U.S. regional bankruptcy trustee has
      appointed a
      seven-member, bondholder-dominated
      Committee of Unsecured Creditors to represent
      interests. The committee includes: HSBC Bank
      Appaloosa Investment Limited Partnership,
      Mutual Shares Fund, Bank of New York, Ventas,

      MEDIQ/PRN Life Support Services and Boise Cascade

      Office Products.

      The first creditors' meeting
      will be on Oct. 22, when a
      company officer will
      testify about company assets and

      Yesterday, a Delaware bankruptcy judge gave
      approval to the rest of Vencor's $100 million

      debtor-in-possession line of financing. That provides
      money for
      day-to-day operations if the company needs it.
      So far,
      Vencor has no outstanding obligation under this


      While the company tries to cope with the
      remaining $2.9
      billion in debt, Ventas has also agreed
      to cut monthly rent
      payments from $19 million to
      $15.1 million beginning
      last month.

      also has to find a way to pay back more money to

      the federal government. Already repaying more than
      million, Vencor could be forced to return
      hundreds of millions'' more, Moloney said last

    • <<<I have learned a valuable lesson with
      Vencor. Numbers don't matter a bit. Vision is
      meaningless. Marketplace potential is worthless. Management
      integrity, honesty, and openess is a must. Without that,
      none of the other factors matters.>>>


      I well knew the Truth of what you wrote above but I
      forgot it in my GREED to make a fast buck when Vencor
      dropped in price and all the insiders were loading up
      last summer.

      The only shark surviving in a a
      school of sharks is a bigger shark. I have no desire to
      be or even swim with sharks. They only end up
      devouring each other. I have better fish to fry. <G>

    • Alas, the lesson has been taught a thousand
      times. Management integrity, honesty and openness is a
      must indeed, but competence is the first requirement.
      I believe that with Vencor, B.L. simply reached his
      level of incompetence. Common enough. I'm watching to
      see who emerges to lead the organization(s) out to
      recovery - or just out.

    • Amen. Learned from a corporate lawyer recently- He thinks Eddie is a shrewd buisnessman, says right now it feels like a start-up company, thinks it's exciting, we'll see....

    • approach to this financial crisis. Why didn't VC
      start with workforce reductions FIRST? Then, if things
      still could not be worked out, you would seek to
      restructure the debt.

      I have learned a valuable lesson
      with Vencor. Numbers don't matter a bit. Vision is
      meaningless. Marketplace potential is worthless. Management
      integrity, honesty, and openess is a must. Without that,
      none of the other factors matters.

    • Thanks again for posting info from Schroder
      especially since
      you no longer own VTR.Hope you continue
      as you get new reports.

      2 points:
      think rental reduction is retro to May 1,1999-not April

      2.$.61 estimated dividend for 1999 per Schroder
      will only
      net an additional $.22 since VTR has
      already paid $.39 in

      The dividend
      estimated to be paid in 2000 is then $.87 per
      assuming their assumptions are correct and the

      proposed deal goes thru.My financial analysis forecasted
      dividend for 1999 and between $.80 and $.90 for
      2000 so we
      basically agree.( now if we can only be
      correct )

      IMO,we are in a waiting period and a
      trading range between
      $4.50 and $5.25 until the
      following occurs:

      1.Govt issue is settled and
      2.VTR's $275,000,000 Oct 31,99 term loan is
      renegotiated and

      Obviously,if they
      both get done,VTR goes up.If not,VTR goes


      As it relates to VCRI,BK court approved
      $100,000,000 DIP
      financing so that appears to be moving
      forward OK.

      2 questions:
      1.Did Schroder
      estimate the new interest rate?The last one
      I saw was

      2.Is Schroder still using $75,000,000 in their
      as the VTR's share of the Govt settlement or did
      increase? I used $100,000,000 in my

      Again,Thanks for info.Very helpful.

    • I just finished reading Schroder's latest report
      occasioned by the analyst's visit to VTR. He is still
      holding to FFO projections of $1.29 for 1999 and $1.32
      for 2000. He expects $.61 dividend to be paid
      sometime in 2000 for 1999 income plus an estimated $.65
      for 2000 income. Dividends should increase after
      that. Says hurdles still substantial before making the
      posted reorg plan legally binding - but those hurdles
      are far more managemeable than what the parties have
      already undertaken in planning the resturcutur of VCRI's
      balance sheet. He says "It appears that the actual filing
      of a plan of reorganization is contingent on
      resolution (at least substantial) of both VTR's $275 billion
      term loan, due on October 31, and the in-process
      settlement of the government's investigation into VCRI's
      historical billing practivces. Our sense is that such issues
      could push the filing of a plan of reorganization into
      November. However, we view the structure of the
      reorganization as very positive for VTR over the longer term, in
      regard to VTR's ability to generate an attractive,
      growing dividend stream. We maintain VTR on our
      Recommended list." Agreement with VTR creditors will probably
      be a last minute thing - but forcing VTR to file for
      bankruptcy protection would not be a desirable for any of
      the creditors since all debt is equal. There will
      likely be an agreement to extend the due date of debt
      and increase the interest rate. Incidentally, the
      agreement to reduce rent is retroactive to April 1, 1999.
      Schroder expects new Plan of Reorganization to be filed in
      mid 4Q 1999 and the new VCRI to be created by the end
      of March 2000. The analyst also expects an agreement
      with the Federal Government during October 15-November
      15 time period. Management will not comment on the
      likely settlement - for obvious reasons. I sold because
      the stock seemed to need a pause. I hope to get back
      in though. Good luck and good investing.

    • Aren't some of the 'old' vencor board members,
      board members of the 'new' ventas? And when the VC did
      it's split, didn't the stock holders receive one share
      of VC and on of VTR ? And It's the Barr/Lundsford
      tag team major participants in the that one and one
      share deal?

      So the same people are still major
      holders of VC and VTR. So they lost money on paper, but
      they still have the shares. Am I right?

      So who
      holds the bonds? Institional investors, mutuals, banks,
      or individuals? The banks hold the major percentage
      now, but is it possible that Mike and Bruce could find
      enough cash to buy their way back in, and take it

      Let me know your thoughts, thanks.

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