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ITT Educational Services Inc. Message Board

  • oxledge oxledge Apr 18, 2009 4:55 PM Flag

    Anyone doubt merits of additional this...

    All the bozo short sellers in the education space saying how education companies are of no value, provide services of no merit, and so on. What a bunch of hogwash.

    Education services of these types have been in the Untied States for over 100 years. One of the most famous graduates of correspondence education was the pioneer of Scientific Management himself, Frederick Taylor. Taylor (1855-1915) in effect invented time/motion study of industrial production and labor in manufacturing. His techniques were so remarkable that they were adopted worldwide, including in Germany, which went on to become the poster child for precision manufacturing and manufacturing excellence (as a result of their adopting Taylor's methods). There are dozens of books written about Taylor that anyone on this board can order and read.

    So, what is the relevance? Taylor has supposed to attend college, but due to eyesight problems, he was unable to attend. After high school he went to work at menial labor jobs in the Phildelpha area, working his way up as he used analysis to determine how labor intensive jobs could be done 2, 3, 4 times faster at half the cost. Taylor's eyesight started to recover, which allowed him to entertain the idea of pursuing education beyond high school level. He undertook correspondence education, earning an engineering degree in 4 years, while working fulltime and getting 5 hours of sleep a night over that four year period. This account has been documented by his close friends in written statements. He went on to be a captain of industry, was hired by the leading manufacturing companies of the day to reorganize their manufacturing, and was sought after to run all the greatest companies in the United States.

    So, what do we have? Here is a guy with a high school education, that worked in the crappiest of menial jobs, working his way up from one hard labor position to another, and then using his intellect, drive and hard work to enhance his education to the point where his novel theories could be taken seriously by both companies and the leading intellectuals and professors of the day. (Harvard Business School at the turn of the century put in a mandatory course for its first year students in Taylor's Scientific Management Techniques). All this done with a correspondence college education where he never stepped in a classroom. All done in the late 1800's. One of the most amazing stories in business ever. No wonder why people have written so many books about the man.

    How short sellers continually demean the value of additional education, of education outside the walls of a classroom, and of education that is not from some name brand University, and any company that provides such education is beyond me. The short sellers view is based totally on negativity, without any consideration of historical precedent, without any consideration of the value that even modest additional education can provide.

    It is clear that the short sellers view is massively in the minority. Consumers know better and that is why the education companies have done so spectacularly over the long haul. And why the short sellers have lost so much money shorting these stocks.

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    • Great point, Ox!

    • yp_dave_fort_myers_beach yp_dave_fort_myers_beach Apr 19, 2009 12:11 PM Flag

      Maybe true for one iota of a second. The VAST MAJORITY of the innocent, vulnerbale kids are getting ripped off by ITT. The educational standards : if you can sign your name on a piece of paper you get a degree. Sorry state of affairs that this is the absolute TRUTH. Yeah, some ITT grads that have half a brain make it in the outside world, but MOST of these poor kids are getting ripped off. ITT is a business and not an educational institution. As a former instructor, I've seen mentally retarded kids graduating from this piece of shYt school. So, yeah, I doubt the merits of this crappy school that continually rip off innocent idiots!

      • 1 Reply to yp_dave_fort_myers_beach
      • Oh, I get it. We should adopt a policy nationwide that prohibits people who want to advance their education because they are "too stupid". Now that sounds like a great policy. Oh, I forgot. We already tried that. Yes, we did that in the South with black people who were of "inferior" intellect, so we didn't let them attend the major universities or good high schools. You are correct, we should totally restrict those deemed "too stupid or poor" for advancing their education.

        We will appoint you the head of the US Government national committee that decides who are "too stupid" to advance the education. Lets see how well that goes over with America.

        You are a complete moron. It is amazing that you were ever an instructor or teacher in the past. With people like you teaching, I can see where we are headed.

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