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Torch Energy Royalty Trust Message Board

  • julydandilion julydandilion Jun 25, 2002 6:07 PM Flag

    the difference

    What is the difference berween DOM and TRU. Why is DOM higher but this pays a higher dividend? Also how can you get info when they decide in Jan. if they will continue the section 29?

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    • WHY DO US RTs exist at all? I cannot see the point in them , except maybe to take some of the risk?

    • Your voice reflects from that brick wall with the uttermost of sincerity. I always say "help those who help themselves", but I do agree that it is important to present the facts as you see them, so that others don't get led astray with mis-information.

      Thanks for your posts.


    • That same person posted very similar crap not too long ago on another RT board and was corrected by several of us there.

      Now, to post the same nonsense here or on any other RT board again must mean he just has his mind made up and is not going to let the facts change his views one iota.

      Maybe he is older and going senile and I shouldn't have been so hard on him. Oh well... if he is coherent enough to post on Yahoo boards, his mind should not be so far gone as to not be able to read and comprehend the simple fact that US RTs have no managements and are not allowed, by law, to make any of the decisions that he is bitching about them doing poorly.


    • Hay, Need High Yield, don't hold back! Let it all hang out. Tell it how it is, don't sugar coat it!!!!! Don't let idiots like this bother you.

    • morowdy,

      Suggest you do some due diligence on US RTs before you buy/sell/short or do anything here!

      You are completely in the dark and clueless as to what these US RTs are all about!



      Say that to yourself until you understand what that means. There is NO ONE to fire, NOBODY is playing golf, NOBODY buying cars, etc.

      Just a single bank EMPLOYEE that deposits the trust's income, cuts the distribution checks and makes the required SEC filings, period!

      "...tell em to get their asses in gear. "

      Seems the ONLY one needing to get their ass in gear is YOU! You need to do an inklinking of homework to learn even the basic fundamentals of US RTs before spewing out such utter nonsense about them on these boards!


    • Yes, see May 14,2002 from tirtz 10-q report. It seems the Can. folks got the right idea. Us trust management got to get out from behind their Houston , Dallas ivory tower desks and find out why costs have ski rocked? Same crap as wcom, dyn, mir, management rather play golf buy new cars, buying 2nd homes instead of doing business. Fire these duds and get someone that STICKS to business not playtime for bonzo. Usually their email or phone numbers are at the bottom of PRs give em a call and tell em to get their asses in gear.

    • US RTs MAY have new additional wells drilled on the properties in which they have an interest. This must be under the control and the decision of the operator, not the trust. Also, there may be secondary recovery methods employed on their existing wells or rework them for added recovery and finally, new wells can be drilled to different pay zones on thier properties.

      However, US RTs CAN NOT purchase or lease additional properties, buy additional reserves from someone else or merge with another O&G company, whereas Canadian RTs can and frequently do so.

      Hope that helps.


    • SJT is the champion of reserve replenishers (they have been paying for almost 20 years without much overall difference in production); and, to my knowledge, also HGT and TELOZ increase their reserves by drilling and well improvement. Definitely TRU and CRT do NOT replenish their reserves. Others (including DOM) I am not sure about. Does this information conflict with the analyses of you other readers of RT threads?

    • "I'm now beginning to think more decidedly in terms favoring Canadian R/T's!"

      I hope you didn't take that from my post.

      Canadian Rts open up another whole can of worms.

      The possibility of adding to reserves sounds good but in reality, they must pay for those new reserves with debt or more units. So management and timing and prices paid are critical to Canadian RTs.

      Most people who say that Canadian RTs can replace their reserves haven't taken the time to do the simple math but are bowing to that slogan without realling considering the ramifications.

      Few of the Canadian RTs have been around long enough to see if that theory even works.

      As a clue to what I'm talking about, suppose US RTs could expand. If US RT "A" that is priced at $10.00 and pays $1.00 per year in distributions on its reserves with a 10 year remaining life buys out US RT "B", also priced at $10.00 and paying out $1.00 yearly from their reserves with a 10 year life, what happens at the end of those 10 years?

      It's not nearly as simple as some believe. The Canadians can buy reserves but the VAST BULK of the income of those reserves are used to pay the distributions on those units paid for those reserves with only a tiny portion that will go to the prior unitholders.

      Debt adds another risk that US RTs don't have. So, managements ability to find UNDERPRICED reserves during low commodity periods will be critical for the long term success of the Canadian RTs.

      Most Canadian RTs have reserve lives of 7-12 years whereas many of the US RTs have been producing for many years and will likely continue to produce years after many of us are dead.

      Finally, Canadian RTs do not share the same tax benefits as their US counterparts.

      Do some serious due diligence before buying any RT, US or Canadian. They pay these high yields for a reason!


    • graham99: Re: your #3660, and
      NHY: Re: your #3661:

      Many sincere thanks to you both for these clarifications of the differences between Stateside and Canadian R/T's. What you both say, makes much sense! Based on this information, I'm now beginning to think more decidedly in terms favoring Canadian R/T's!

      Good luck!

      t now makes

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