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General Motors Company Message Board

  • wngr123 wngr123 Dec 28, 2012 2:35 PM Flag


    "This election was a watershed and trickle down and probably large scale outsourcing are going to be coming to an end in the USA. Even Apple is bringing jobs the USA . I think you need to accept that trickle down is at an end in the USA."

    This doesn't have anything to do with 'trickle down' economics. Trickle down refers to tax breaks and other government subsidies to private companies to improve profitability, theoretically to benefit share holders and add wealth to the general population.

    The act of moving work off shore is merely a private company trying to cut costs so they can give their shareholders a decent return. In fact, 'trickle down' economics will work opposite the move to lower cost countries because, according to Obama, he will devise tax credits to keep jobs here. Of course, all of that is silly. Mexican wages are about $10 per hour depending where in Mexico you are. US wages, at least for the OEM's are $50+ per hour. What's he going to do, subsidize each hour worked in the US with $40?? My point is that as long as that gap remains, American workers are in serious jeopardy.

    For the components that I was responsible for in my GM days, there were about 3.5 man hours of GM labor in each one. We made EXACTLY the same component in Ramos Arizpe, Mexico and Warren, MI. Taking the $40/hour gap in wage/benefit structure that created a $140 per unit advantage for the Mexican operation. We could ship this component from Ramos Arizpe to Oshawa, Ontario for less than $12 per unit. Given these economics, how can you justify keeping the U.S. operation open?

    It's crazy to expect a multi national company to ignore these economics. As a shareholder, would you want the company to turn its back on an additional $140 per unit profit?

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    • Wngr gets it. The guy knows what the hell he's talking about.

      You never do.

      All your ideas about GM may be well-meaning and well-intentioned but they are all backward. Things don't work like that in real life. You think these companies can just pay and pay whatever these union slugs think they 'deserve', regardless of whether they add significant value?

      When GM employees all give a fair day's work for a fair day's pay and stop with the voluminous contracts and stupid union work rules supposedly designed to protect jobs, they might actually protect their jobs.

      You can demand all the pay you want.
      You can demand all the bennies you want.
      You can demand all the health care you want.
      You can demand all the vacation you want.
      But if you don't want the work at market rates, they'll simply move it to someplace that DOES want it.
      Sure there are times you can even get it all, if a company is both desperate and wealthy enough.

      New GM is neither.


      Sentiment: Strong Sell

      • 2 Replies to webuchadnezzar_reva
      • Sap
        of course wngr gets it,based on the politics NOW.Those I believe are getting ready to change in this country.This country needs revenue and you do not get revenue by outsourcing.Do not think for one minute that those folks in DC are not aware that two things have to happen.Asia has to be brought in line and the multis have to be brought in line-and DC is very good at following the money.You can choose to wish that the government is not going to go after these things.That is not the reality-everyone on both sides agree that these jobs have to come back and I think even members of the GOP not worried about getting right hooked in the primaries are realizing that wages must come up in this country.You have been told numerous times that everything is cyclical and that unions would come back because of the excesses of business. This is already showing up as the UAW won a ratification victory at Johnson Controls in of all places-Alabama.Most all the time I agree with wngr,and he is right about the CURRENT circumstances.Those circumstances though ,can and are going to change by the people who truly decide policy in this country-Washington,DC.Now I still want to know if you voted for the guy from OC that is hung up on dinosaur farts?

        Sentiment: Strong Buy

      • web, when are your working Hours? Now be honest, are you on the payroll while posting right now?

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