I'd like to add my personal thanks to the Radware
folks, many of whom I know personally.
It must be
great to feel the pride of a first-ever profitable
quarter and year!
Sure, they make us [those who
invested in their stock and believe in the company, as
opposed to one-day/week speculators] happy at the
prospect of seeing a constant surge and newly-found
heights for the stock.
Just remember that these
results stem from the hard work of a dedicated group of
people who deliver great products, fantastic marketing
force, and fine management to top it all.
good work boys!
- Yak (in Tel-Aviv)
Now for a little lesson in
Network Address Translation(NAT). Since NAT devices are
the endpoint for a TCP connection and then initiate
and new TCP connections on behalf of the requesting
client, there are limitations on...
not a good teacher! :-) NAT devices, like firewalls
are not, I repeat _not_, endpoints for TCP
connections. NAT devices rewrites TCP (and sometimes UDP)
headers, but they do not terminate or initiate any TCP
connections... But you are right, there are limitations. But
these limitations are not due to the termination of TCP
sessions! They are due to limits on session tables (=RAM)
and CPU load.
Ps. But yes, I am
You said, "I am trying to make an intelligent
decision about where to distribute my hard-earned dollars
based on information I'm gathering from the ITM
environment." I would like to suggest to you that this is the
wrong way to find out where invest your money. Many
people here will balk at what I am about to tell you.
The technology matters only as far as being on par
with the competition. RDWR from my limited
understanding is at least on par with FFIV for instance.
However, when you are choosing to make an investment this
IS NOT ENOUGH. Good technology loses the war much of
the time unless it coincides with a good business
case. If RDWR ends up being a leader in the burgeoning
industry it will be because of their business case -not
the technology. As I said many people will disagree
with this, but history has shown it to be true.
Actually, I don't want to take credit for that
dumb statement... I was simply repeating statements
and perceptions gathered over time from OTHER
misinformed network managers out there (and believe it or
not, there are a lot of them).
really don't care where a product is made as long as it
stands up to the manufacturer's claims and they stand
behind their products 110%.
Now for a little
lesson in Network Address Translation(NAT). Since NAT
devices are the endpoint for a TCP connection and then
initiate and new TCP connections on behalf of the
requesting client, there are limitations on:
number of connections per second
2) The total number
The HolonTech products that we purchased do not use
NAT as their load distribution method thus bypassing
the limitations imposed by NAT. It makes a
distribution decision and then forwards the packets at Layer
2, just like every other device in the path from
client to host should in order to conform to the RFC
Standard for the IP protocol.
The only device that
should be performing NAT is a firewall, and for good
reason. If a firewall is in place, why introduce two
layers of NAT in a firewalled environment by using yet
another NAT-based device?
So, back to my statement
about "unlimited number of sessions". To reiterate what
I said before; it can handle an "unlimited number
of sessions" because guess what? There are no
What you might have thought I said was
that it could handle an unlimited amount of bandwidth
which is a totally different thing, and I agree with
you on this point... NOTHING has unlimited bandwidth
I hope this clears things up a bit. I am in this to
make money just like everyone else.
say I'm doing some load-balancing with my money; I am
trying to make an intelligent decision about where to
distribute my hard-earned dollars based on information I'm
gathering from the ITM environment.
boards are just one place I gather information. I never
let prejudice or hype bias my opinions... Only
facts... And I have not misrepresented any of the
information I've posted here regardless of what you might
> 2) There is still a major concern
> placing your company's product at the heart
> of a mission-critical network and being
> Israeli based company. There is a certain
amount of unease among network managers
> when it
comes to this part of
This is one of the dumbest, and
statements made on this board. If you did
whatsoever, you'll realize
that much of the technology
that you use
is actually Israeli based. Anywhere
the Intel pentium that you're using to
the network card that's plugged into your
As far as your "ANALysis", for example:
[HolonTech's] "HyperFlow2 switch is
flow-based and has no
limitation on the
number of sessions since it operates
Layer2 ..." What BOGUS reasoning! Repeat
for a reality check: "NOTHING
I'm sure that RDWR has advantages over
manufacturers for LB systems, and
has some disadvantages
let's let reason and not prejudice
stock-ownership-induced overhype cloud
our ANALyses. In this
field of LB systems, the fact that there
are less than 5 manufacturers with viable
(btw, includes RDWR), everyone
is set to make money
(except those who
short these companies).
I reviewed your product when implementing a load
balancing solution for my company's high traffic website
and Radware did not make the first cut...
You need BGP to handle INCOMING traffic unless you
use DNS to divert traffic from downed paths.
Currently, there is no other way around this problem. So,
either you are displacing BGP for OUTGOING traffic or,
you are using DNS to return the address of the
functioning site. And the article does state that you are
using it for OUTGOING traffic.
2) There is still
a major concern about placing your company's
product at the heart of a mission-critical network and
being an Israeli based company. There is a certain
amount of unease among network managers when it comes to
this part of their infrastructure.
is NOT the only company doing only load balancing or
ITM. Take for instance, HolonTech Corporation, whose
product we have implemented quite successfully. Their
HyperFlow2 switch is flow-based and has no limitation on the
number of sessions since it operates at Layer 2, not at
Layer 3 like your product.
HyperFlow2 load balance's our CheckPoint firewalls. Six of
them from one HyperFlow2 as a matter of fact. They
have always had this capability. I believe they were
the first on the block to do this.
load balance our OUTGOING traffic among 3 T3's from
different ISP's, as well as our 6 Sun E450 web servers, all
from the same box as the one clustering our
firewalls!!!!!. They hold a patent on router pooling. And since
they operate at Layer 2, SSL is not even a
5) I can't speak for their entire company, but the
employees we dealt with during the sales and implementation
process we awesome, both professionally and
I'm not trying to pick on you personally, but as you
stated yourself, you thought the board could use "one
I own a bit of stock in all of
the ITM companies because I think it's a white hot
market and room for incredible growth
Good luck to all!!!
First off, let me explain who I am. I am a
Regional Sales Manager for Radware so this message will be
biased ( obviously ) but I think I can provide some
objective reasons why Radware is a good buy.
new Linkproof product. It allows the use of multiple
ISP connections without having to use BGP as a
routing protocol. Anyone who knows anthing about BGP
knows that the customers hate it, the ISPs hate it and
it rarely if ever does what it is intended to do.
There is a brief article at
which talks about it briefly.
2. Money in the
bank. As we all know this is an Israeli company that
has great products and feels that their performance
alone will dictate the stock's desirability. We all
know that is not true. If people are not given a
reason to buy the stock, they won't. Then again, some of
the best values in the market are those that fit this
category. You decide.
3. Where the market
is headed. Radware is the ONLY company in this field
that does nothing but load balancing or ITM. Therefore
our products are more focused thatn say an Alteon,
who also makes switches, etc. If true load balancing
is the goal nobody ever beats Radware. Ther market
is headed towards specialization and the recent
Yahoo, Ebay attacks are good proof. As the only company
to track multiple TCP sessions from a single IP
address as a single session ( regardless of how many
there are ) we can better defend against DOS attacks
like this. All the traffic in the world from 1000
servers is 1000 sessions in our box, regardless of the
TCP sessions involved. We even have a feature called
delayed binding that will make our box respond to SYN's,
not the server, and keep them in the client table
until they time out or send a synack. This keeps the
server free and puts the load on the radware box which
is infinitely more able to do this.
balancing firewalls. Again, as specialists we heard that
customers needed a way to eliminate the firewall as a
single point of failure. Our Fireproof box allows active
use of two firewalls simultaneously while maintaining
state between the two in order to support SSL. Nobody
even has a product that comes close, as far as I have
5. The company overall. I have worked for many
companies in my 15 year sales career but none has ever
approached Radware in the way they treat their employees and
the commitment they have to doing what is right. Few
people leave as it is almost impossible to find a better
job. In fact, if any seasoned IT professionals are out
there looking for work please feel free to email me at
firstname.lastname@example.org We are hiring and looking for good people all
over the country.
Again let me
I AM A RADWARE EMPLOYEE!!! I make no bones about
the fact that I am trying to tell you why I like this
company. God knows, whoever out there is reading this
(SEC) I am NOT trying to hype the stock with bullsh*t.
All of the above is true, to the best of my
knowledge. Everyone, take this with a grain of salt, I am
not a financial genius and pretend to know nothing
that you can't find yourselves on the web. All I will
say is that I owned the stock before I went to work
for them and still own a large portion of what I
I believe in the company and thought
the board could use one more opinion.
I read your RDWR vs. FFIV analysis on
Deep, intelligent, extremely well written and makes a
lot of sense.
A breath of fresh air compared to
the some of the zombies that wage their stupid
ego-fights on this forum.
I myself strongly believe in
Radwere's future. Not because I hold a modest amount (1000)
of their shares and just hope for the best, but
because I personally know the leaders of the company and
have lots of faith in their vision, ability and
Again, thank you for such well presented arguments.
"RADWARE strives to find the path of least
resistance. The company provides hardware and software that
help customers such as BMC Software, Gateway, and Sony
efficiently manage Internet traffic on their networks. Its
Web Server Director hardware optimizes network
traffic by distributing it among groups of servers to
avoid congestion at any one point. RADWARE's FireProof
product directs Internet traffic through a company's
hardware and software firewall security systems. The
company distributes worldwide primarily through resellers
such as National Business Group."
This is from the
company report section of moneycentral.com. One large key
that is not mentioned here is a partnership with
LUCENT which is huge
.clearstation.com/). Another big (and overlooked)partnership is with
ABC who is really strong in the UK(fastest growing
internet market right now) Read link:
At the bottom you will see ABC has very good
relationships:"On-going support and maintenance is effectively provided
with both in-house technical support and through close
working relationships with strategic partners including
RADWARE, Hewlett Packard, Network Appliance and Sun
Microsystems. ABC Solutions has support capabilities for UNIX,
Windows NT and Linux." This also ties in with another
partnership they have with Network
But ABC isn't their only tie to the strong UK market,
Of course, like everyone here, I have my own
opinions on the RDWR vs. FFIV issue. Here they