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Investors Title Co. Message Board

  • astral_tsar astral_tsar Mar 16, 2005 2:44 PM Flag


    ITIC looking very weak to me. Risk of a price collapse is high on any bad news, IMO. With refi market looking lean, scary earnings news could come any quarter.

    I've sold some and am preparing myself mentally to see some low prices on the rest of my holdings. If it sinks below $27, I'll buy my shares back.

    Best of luck all.

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    • Ok, but then they do have USD 2.40 or so in cash, for a total value closer to $11 per share. Which, ok, that is where I exited, so maybe my feelings on this point aren't really news.

    • FWIW, I just ground thru the Natuzzi numbers for my first time since like 2003. I'm not sure that I see any discount. I'm worried by the continuing high capex in the absense of revenue improvement. I think free cash flow may be a good estimate of owner earnings -- perhaps 30 to 35 million euros per year, or 36 to 42 million USD. Multiply that by a P/E of 12, and you get roughly today's share price.


    • at least you got off the elevator on one of the upper floors---some of us just ride it up and down to no effect!

    • Wow, Natuzzi is getting down near where I bought it last time. I don't mind another run if the price is right!

    • Well, disagreement makes the world go around. Best of luck.

    • Astral Tsar: Thanks for providing the link to Winn Dixie's more recent financial statemnets. I do like to read financial statements, but these are not much fun. Long and involved and put out by a bankrupt company. I like things simple and clear cut. My guess is that Winn Dixie was being less than candid to its shareholders with its financial statements prior to its bankruptcy.

      I guess the big question right now for investors is, will the current shareholders be wiped out in the re-organization? I don't want to speculate on that. I don't think we have good enough information to make a sound judgement.

      Finally, to me the more important factor than comparative sales between ABS and Winn Dixie is which one can make a profit. Profitability is the real trick. Anybody can generate sales in the grocery business if they are willing to sell at a loss.

    • There are two more recent quarters filed by the way. The latest ended 1/12/05. Here are the Qs.

      Qtr ended Jan 12 2005

      Qtr ended Sep 22 2004

    • pmlljl,

      Winn Dixie certainly isn't for the faint of heart.

      The interesting question (to me) is the huge disparity in market price. Winn-Dixie sells for less than 1% of sales, while Albertson's sells for 18% of sales. So if Albertson's in the future will be 20x more profitable (per dollar of sales today) then the relative market valuations are correct.

    • astral tsar: I looked at the Winn Dixie financial statements that I could find on Yahoo. The latest balance sheet I could find was June, 2004. Of course, a lot has happened since then. They reported losses and write-offs of about $550,000,000 since then. Isn't it amusing how the carried goodwill and intangibles of about $90,000,000 on their balance sheet right up to the date they filed for bankruptcy? I believe "goodwill" should represent the excess earning power of your business not how much you overpaid when you bought a business.

      In addition, if Winn Dixie is forced to close more stores, they will probably have additional losses on leases, inventory severance etc. Then comes the hard part, they have to compete with an expanding WalMart.

      Therefore, my guess
      is that Winn Dixie disappears sooner or later and I am not interested. It could come out of bankruptcy as a smaller company and then merge with somebody else.

      I was interested that you brought up Winn Dixie because I have recently become somewhat interested in Albertsons. I have not bought any yet and may not. Most grocery chains pay very little in dividends if any. Most don't have much tangible book value. They face growing competition from WalMart and there are too many stores.

      I think Albertsons is a cut above the others in terms of book value and dividends and I use and like their stores.

      That said, the food business is very competitive and the stock market does not look good to me now. Nevertheless, ABS is making
      new lows and yielding about 4%. I intend to keep my eye on it.

    • Heh. It ain't over til it's over.

      By the way, if you like to really read financials in depth, you might give Winn-Dixie's a try. Here's the question: why did they file chapter 11?

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