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Inergy, L.P. Message Board

bosox_pats 209 posts  |  Last Activity: Apr 7, 2014 6:31 PM Member since: Nov 22, 2010
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  • bosox_pats by bosox_pats Apr 7, 2014 6:31 PM Flag

    Listen to it - impressive.

  • Reply to

    Alerian Index MLP

    by jberns2421 Mar 20, 2014 6:08 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Mar 31, 2014 6:57 AM Flag

    It is both an index and a fund. It's a 40 Act mutual fund operated as an ETF. The ETF has about $7.5 B of assets, it's called the Alerian MLP ETF and it's ticker is AMLP. There have been ETN's sponsored by Wall Street Banks that also mimic this index.

  • Price target for ATLS set at $53 and ARP at $24.

  • Reply to

    APL looking to sell its JV interest in pipeline

    by bjfcpainc Mar 11, 2014 6:35 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Mar 13, 2014 11:34 AM Flag

    Although APL only owns 20%, they have a 50% vote on all capital projects and growth cap ex. This ability to shape ongoing decisions has more value to the buyer than it's 20% economic interest.

  • Reply to

    Tax Shelter Partnerships

    by gaapdino4 Mar 12, 2014 3:58 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Mar 13, 2014 11:30 AM Flag

    No dope. ATLS is not the sponsor of the drilling partnerships. ARP is the sponsor and it's stock has been trending higher.......

  • Reply to

    ATLS vs ARP

    by xocy713 Mar 4, 2014 12:27 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Mar 4, 2014 6:19 PM Flag

    ATLS the GP of ARP, APL and now AGP is a leveraged play on the performance of the underlying listed MLP's. The leverage is not necessarily financial leverage through the use of debt, but rather, the leverage inherent to the GP's contractual participation in the earnings and cash flow of the operating MLP's through the incentive distribution rights, or IDRs. Basically, once the IDRs are in the money, the GP shares in the cash flow dollar for dollar. This increases the cost of capital for the MLP but the return on capital for the GP is incredibly high. In fact, the incremental capital the GP needs to put up is zero so mathematically the return on capital is undefined (really good) as the denominator in the calculation is zero.

    You will notice that the GPs always trade at a significantly lower yield than the underlying operating MLP's. In this case, ARP trades to an 11% yield, APL 8% and ATLS 4%. This is justified given the GP's much higher yield or distribution growth rate given the leverage to the IDRs, plus the very high returns on invested capital. Inherently, the GP will always be a more volatile security given these dynamics. In my case, I own 2 shares of ATLS for every share of ARP I own. ATLS has the upside but ARP protects my downside. If I only had to own one and I didn't want to look at it for 3-5 years, I would own ATLS as it is a superior mouse trap bar none.... I predict this will be one of the best performers on the NYSE over the next 3-5 years. It trades to little over a $2 B market cap. There is a lot of room to the upside as we are not even close to dealing with the math of large numbers yet.....

  • Reply to

    2014 Guidance now 1.95 to 2.45 per unit

    by davidbdc2001 Feb 27, 2014 7:23 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 28, 2014 7:26 AM Flag

    At mid-point, the units are yielding 5.4%. The group average for GP's is about 3.6%. If we were so lucky to trade back to this level our upside would be $61 this year. A 4% yield gets you to $55. My target is somewhere in the the middle this year of $55-$60. Given the miss at APL, ATLS should trade at a discount to the group. APL needs to get back on track and hit and exceed some targets. APL could buy the Chevron pipe which could be upside. ARP will always be on the acquisition hunt which is also upside. I'm keen to learn when will Atlas Growth Partners be formally disclosed more broadly. In December, they modified their Form D SEC filing to increase the amount expected to be raised for AGP from $300 MM to $500 MM.

    Any way you look at ATLS the GP, there are multiple forms of upside to this story especially over the next few years. I still think you see these units priced north of $100 in 3-5 years with distributions of $5 or more.....

  • Reply to

    Developement Subsidiary?

    by jcdukegrad Feb 27, 2014 9:07 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 28, 2014 7:17 AM Flag

    Yes indeed, I believe it is Atlas Growth Partners. Interesting, they have allocated some of the GP.

  • Reply to

    Hey Bosox

    by stlbeerman196810 Feb 12, 2014 9:04 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 26, 2014 9:13 AM Flag


    I totally agree. Someone has been leaning on the units over last week subsequent to APL call. Can't wait to hear what ATLS provides for distribution guidance for 2014/15. We should hear about ARP syndicate raise. Perhaps something on Atlas Growth Partners as well.

  • Reply to

    Cooperman bought 60K yesterday of ARP

    by chegerar Feb 20, 2014 6:34 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 25, 2014 5:33 AM Flag

    Yes, I'm in ARP. I own 1/2 as much of ARP relative to ATLS, or 100,000 units. They announced the January distribution after close yesterday of $0.1933, or $0.58 quarterly, or $2.32 annualized.

  • Reply to

    Cooperman bought 60K yesterday of ARP

    by chegerar Feb 20, 2014 6:34 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 24, 2014 6:29 AM Flag

    My guess is ARP units trading weak as market anticipates supply to fund last acquisition. I also sense ARP is up to something big on the acquisition side. Should be an interesting earnings call this week at ARP/ATLS. Also, we should hear ARP's January distribution to be paid in March.

  • Reply to

    $250 MM Secondary

    by bosox_pats Feb 23, 2014 7:43 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 24, 2014 6:23 AM Flag

    Most companies issue secondaries on a drive-by basis these days meaning they notify the market 6-8 hours before the close, and then price the offering off the closing price. Many times the issuer will issue the shares under Rule 144A and then exchange the same securities for registered shares once the S-3 becomes effective. I wouldn't be surprised if APL issue the securities tonight.

    If a deal can be done and $31 and it is accretive, so be it. Obviously more accretive at $34 - $36 but that price was a few weeks ago. As an ATLS holder, as long as it is accretive and more units are issued, ATLS comes out way ahead.

    Hoping for purchase of the Chevron pipe for $400 - $500 MM.

  • bosox_pats by bosox_pats Feb 23, 2014 7:43 PM Flag

    Interesting timing. I bet this secondary is geared toward showing Jeffries, Chevron's advisor, that APL has the financial flexibility to bid and close on the Texas pipeline 20% owned by APL and 80% by Chevron. Atlas and Chevron have done a few deals over the years. I bet this secondary will be followed up by APL buying the 80% of the pipeline it doesn't own from Chevron. On the conference call, Dubay said they were interested in buying as long as accretive. This is a positive for APL & ATLS.

  • Reply to


    by jberns2421 Feb 17, 2014 8:08 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 17, 2014 9:25 PM Flag

    They are calling for an annualized exit run rate for 2014 of $2.60 which is $0.65 per unit. Not much in distribution growth rate in 2014 from APL. However, I suspect this is an expectations game and they have probably learned their lesson. My guess is they beat this number a fair margin.......The projects they list are actually fairly impressive and they set for nice growth in out years.........

  • My back of envelope calculation is about $0.10 of DCF to ATLS given high splits on IDRs. We are in the money. They are probably working on more deals at ARP. I also think APL buys Chevrons 80% share of the TX pipe. More accretion.....

  • Reply to

    Hey Bosox

    by stlbeerman196810 Feb 12, 2014 9:04 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 13, 2014 5:55 AM Flag

    Your numbers are correct. There are a couple Wall Street earnings models that are pretty good. One thing you have to remember is ATLS holds roughly 7.5 MM preferred units of ARP that participate in the dividends one for one and convert into common units I believe in 3 years. APL does get an IDR holiday between 0.65 - 0.70 based on a deal from long ago. I believe it is a $$$ driven holiday and it kicks in at $0.65 so the high end may change with share issuance.

    I think the 4Q earnings call has been delayed as they are waiting for the Engineering Reserve report for both ARP and ATLS. After doing a little more home work, I believe the reason ATLS did show an increase in distribution this quarter was due to the timing impact on the drawdown of their credit line (interest charges) to fund the asset purchase's of the preferred and E&P from the last ARP transaction.

    Interesting, ARP may actually announce it's January distribution payable in March prior to the 4Q conference call...... This will give us a tell on the ATLS distribution for the March quarter given the math discussed above.

  • Interesting - day after going ex-dividend. I wouldn't be surprised if Cooperman added to position....

  • Reply to

    Setting up for big 1Q at ATLS

    by bosox_pats Jan 31, 2014 7:33 AM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 9, 2014 7:12 AM Flag

    Yes, I'm a big bull. By end of this year, ATLS should be annualizing $2.80 in distributions, or $0.70 per quarter. At a 4% yield, this gets you to a $70 unit price. By the second half of 2015, we will be annualizing $3.50+ which would get you a $88 unit price at 4%. Hard to find those types of names in a market that has been picked over. Plus, one gets the downside protection of the yield.

    I do believe they are up to something. My guess is APL is trying to figure out how to buy the other 80% of the Chevron pipe they don't own and make it accretive. We know they are forming a 3rd MLP at Atlas Growth Partners which will give us a new IDR stream down the road. Plus, we will have a liquidity event when they take it public. ARP has filed a very broad shelf registration so I'm sure you are right that they are up to something on the acquisition front.

    I believe they are awaiting their engineering report on the state of ARP's reserves. My guess is their reserve position has improved meaningfully given the uplift in NG prices recently making more drilling locations economic. Once they have this in hand, they will announce 4Q results. In addition, ARP will announce results of their syndicate fund raising which I believe will come in better than $150 MM.

    Enjoy the ride!

  • bosox_pats by bosox_pats Feb 6, 2014 6:03 AM Flag

    Chevron has put it's Texas pipeline for sale. APL owns 20% of the pipe. The dilemma for APL is buying the 80% owned by Chevron, selling it's 20% interest with Chevron, or just holding the 20% and settling in with a new partner and operator. For Chevron, it probably gets a higher value if it can sell 100% as buyers are reluctant to take on an unknown partner. Obviously, APL will play the card of trying to buy the 80% cheaper than if went to auction. Chevron might take a cheaper price to avoid the auction selling process and cost. It would be a big deal for APL as the pipe is reportedly worth $1.0 B. I think this would come down to how much paper in the form of APL Chevron would be willing to take. Chevron taking the equity would make it easier to raise debt capital for APL.

    When Chevron announced the sale of it's pipe, APL's units traded down about $2 as the market anticipated more shares from APL and it has weighed on APL's trading performance ever since. I have no idea if APL paid $1.0 B if the deal would be accretive or how much future capital the pipe requires. One thing I do know is APL cannot afford to do non-accretive deals.

  • Reply to

    how much a month

    by mertxesapp Jan 30, 2014 2:42 PM
    bosox_pats bosox_pats Feb 2, 2014 7:26 AM Flag

    It will not be three equal monthly installments. They will be gradually increasing the Distribution over time. Last year, 2013 distributions totaled $2.19, including the distribution paid Feb 2014. My guess is they will be closer to $2.60 in 2014. Therefore, the distribution will be gradually rising over time and month to month, sometimes flat, sometimes up.

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