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The GEO Group, Inc. Message Board

cwn600 272 posts  |  Last Activity: Jul 21, 2014 7:52 PM Member since: Dec 28, 1999
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  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 2:51 PM Flag

    Well, at least your stupidity is consistent. That means anything you claim can be dismissed as wrong. Saves time. Thanks.

  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 2:48 PM Flag

    Not yet.

  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 2:05 PM Flag

    "Where is that "cwn600" to see what he's got to say now?"

    You want me to clear up your confusion, do you? Sure. Since you can't figure it out for yourself, I'd be glad to.

    "I've been a GERON shareholder for about 4-5 years, I sold June 26th and got back in July 8th, that shouldn't matter cause I was a shareholder as of May 28th, 2014."

    Being a shareholder on May 28th doesn't have anything to do with it, since you bought back in before the ex-date. It is the ex-date that determines who gets the dividend, not the record date, and the ex-date has not yet been established. Why do you think the company said today that any shareholder of record on May28th who sells their shares before the ex-date is also selling their right to receive the Asterias shares? When you sold GERN on June 26 you also sold your right to the Asterias spinoff. But you bought back your right to the Asterias shares when you bought GERN back on July 8th. The right to the spinoff is attached to the GERN shares until the close of trading on the distribution date. That is the purpose of the due bills.

    Have any of those facts penetrated your closed mind?

  • Reply to

    mr_brightside_xy and others, do you undertand now?

    by cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 11:03 AM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 1:55 PM Flag

    Your memory is very selective. Your exact response to my explanation was "I don't read it that way." (mr_brightside_xy • Jun 23, 2014 2:17 PM)

  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 12:31 PM Flag

    "are the shares of asterias, which is not actually a ticker, going to instantly convert into warrants to buy BTX?"

    No. Upon completion of the spinoff of the Asterias shares, the BTX warrants will then be distributed to the new Asterias shareholders, that's all. The Asterias shares don't convert into anything.

  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 12:26 PM Flag

    "the price will crash for sure after the distribution, if it happens as you are suggesting"

    The Asterias shares aren't worth enough to crash the GERN price on the ex-date, are they?

  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 12:23 PM Flag

    "when I search I don't find the info that you are referring to"

    That's pretty hard to believe. A google search for "deferred ex-date" (including the quotation marks) turns up good explanations on several sites. A search for "deferred ex-date" without the quotation marks puts at the top of the return list a link to the New York Stock Exchange Listed Company Manual. Click on that link and it tells you more than you'd ever want to know, but if you scroll down to the part with the heading "Deferred "Ex" date and Use of Due Bills" it says, "When the issuance of a stock dividend, or stock distribution, or subscription right is subject to fulfillment of some requirement or condition (such as further corporate action, or action or approval by some public authority) which will not be fulfilled before the normal "ex" date, "ex" dealings are deferred and due-bills are used until a specific date subsequent to the date on which the prerequisite requirement or condition is to be fulfilled or until further notice if the date of such fulfillment is indeterminate.

    The date fixed for "ex" dealings in such a case is usually the first or second business day after the Exchange receives notice that the prerequisite requirement or condition has been fulfilled, depending on the hour at which such notice is received. The date fixed for redemption of due-bills is usually the first or second business day after the mailing of the stock dividend or three business days after the mailing of the distribution shares or the subscription rights.

    The deferral of the "ex" date and use of due-bills in situations involving conditional distributions is necessary to avoid the risk that a loss may occur should the prerequisite requirement or condition not be met."

  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 12:02 PM Flag

    "Why don't you google "date of record" first"

    I'll do it for him. From the website Understanding Dividend Dates:

    The Purpose of the Record Date

    With all dividends, the record date establishes that only the shares outstanding as of that date are eligible for the dividend. With normal dividends that is a moot point because the ex-dividend date, being two business days before the record date, has already established which shares (and which shareholders) qualify for the dividend. But in the case of a dividend of 25% or more of the company's stock price, spinoffs and stock dividends, the ex-dividend date is after the record date, usually many days or weeks after, so the company may, if it chooses to do so, issue additional stock after the record date but before the ex-dividend date without affecting the gross amount of the declared dividend. While occasions of a secondary offering during such a period are rare, there are many more instances of shares being issued through dividend reinvestment plans and through exercise of stock options and convertible securities.

    In cases of a deferred ex-date, the only function of the record date is to determine on which shares the dividend is paid. Because of that -- and this is a critical point -- it is the ex-dividend date that determines who qualifies for the dividend, not the record date.

  • Reply to

    AST Shares

    by ryanvball1 Jul 11, 2014 8:38 AM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 11:57 AM Flag

    "why should I care about something that is not mentioned in the SEC filing, but only on a message board?"

    Wrong question. Right question: Why do you keep posting about something you claim to care nothing about?

  • Reply to

    GERN Memo Today

    by blackmarango Jul 11, 2014 11:40 AM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 11:55 AM Flag

    "Are any of you guys just a little surprised that GERN would TODAY issue a memo through the brokers and NOT tell us when the distribution date for the Asterias shares is?"

    Not at all. This is quite common with spinoffs. The distribution date isn't established yet, but they're trying to clear up some of the confusion over who gets the Asterias shares. They're doing a poor job of it, but at least they're trying.

  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 11:52 AM Flag

    "I see nothing in the SEC filing about a deferred ex-date."

    You sure are persistent for somebody who claims he doesn't care what happens.

    "do you have more information to provide other than the SEC filing"

    Yes, I have more information to provide other than the SEC filing. I've been providing it here over and over and over again, all the while urging people like you to research it for yourself, but all you do is deny, deny, deny. And you have the chutzpa to claim you don't care!

    More often than not, companies issuing dividends don't ever mention the ex-date because it's not the company that sets the ex-date, it's the stock exchange. When the ex-date comes after the record date instead of before it, it's called a deferred ex-date. Although the SEC itself doesn't use that exact term, on its website it does describe the circumstances of when such an ex-date is used, and the consequences of selling the underlying stock before the deferred ex-date: "Sometimes a company pays a dividend in the form of stock rather than cash. The stock dividend may be additional shares in the company or in a subsidiary being spun off. The procedures for stock dividends may be different from cash dividends. The ex-dividend date is set the first business day after the stock dividend is paid (and is also after the record date).

    If you sell your stock before the ex-dividend date, you also are selling away your right to the stock dividend. Your sale includes an obligation to deliver any shares acquired as a result of the dividend to the buyer of your shares, since the seller will receive an I.O.U. or "due bill" from his or her broker for the additional shares."

    "Are you guys just trying to keep people from dumping the stock"

    Ah, the last refuse of the ignorant -- accuse others of nefarious purposes. How does that help you to understand what's really happening?

  • Reply to

    FDA hold was real suspect. Damage done however.

    by docaiii Jul 11, 2014 6:49 AM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 11:28 AM Flag

    "They did open heart surgery on my cousin in 1960 when she was six and now she has 4 kids and 4 grandkids."

    Are you saying that procreation is a direct result of heart surgery?

  • Reply to

    AST Shares

    by ryanvball1 Jul 11, 2014 8:38 AM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 11:26 AM Flag

    "Because I don't care"

    Then why are you posting?

  • Reply to

    AST Shares

    by ryanvball1 Jul 11, 2014 8:38 AM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 11:18 AM Flag

    "That's bizarre and would be most unusual."

    It's neither bizarre or unusual. In fact, it's standard procedure for spinoffs. That you are unfamiliar with the method only shows you don't know as much about stock trading as you claim to.

    "Those shares MUST be distributed to those record holders as of MAY 28th. PERIOD."

    And they will be. But while that's the end of your knowledge, that's not the end of the process.

    "please reread that "notice from Geron", which also makes no sense."

    It makes no sense only to people like you who refuse to educate yourself on the rest of the process. What you're overlooking is the due bill part of the process. Why don't you educate yourself on due bills. With the Internet, it should take only five minutes. Why do you prefer wallowing in ignorance forever over learning the facts in five minutes?

  • Reply to

    AST Shares

    by ryanvball1 Jul 11, 2014 8:38 AM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 11:09 AM Flag

    "I also am not familiar with this odd type of distribution. I've had a lot of div stocks, and the date of record comes after the ex-date, 3 days after the day that counts, because it takes 3 days for transactions to clear."

    Why don't you do yourself a favor and do a google search for "deferred ex-date" and learn how and why it works?

  • On June 23rd I tried to correct your misunderstanding of the value of the NAO spinoff and you rejected my explanation. Today the company announced that the value of NAO spinoff will be determined exactly as I explained.

    On June 23rd, I said, "The value of the NAO shares was $15 at the time of the stock dividend announcement. The proportional value of the spinoff per NAT share was 13 cents. The value of NAO shares is now 18.36, or 22% more than it was at the time of the stock dividend announcement in January. If the NAO shares are now worth 22% more than they were at the time of the announcement, then so is the value of the stock dividend. The dividend was valued at 13 cents per NAT share in January and is now worth 22% more. That's 15.86 cents."

    NAO stock has continued to rise, so the value of the spinoff has continued to increase in the same proportion I described, as noted by the company this morning: "The dividend is calculated on the basis of $0.13 to be distributed per NAT share, and the November 2013 NAO offering price of $15 per share, implying roughly one NAO share per 115.4 NAT shares. ... Since NAO`s November 2013 offering at $15 per share, NAO shares have gone up in value significantly. Based on the most recent NAO closing price of $20.15, this increase in the value of the NAO share is equivalent to about 34%, implying a total value of the dividend-in-kind of about $0.17 per share."

    Got it?

  • cwn600 cwn600 Jul 11, 2014 2:22 AM Flag

    "The record date is the 28th of May"

    Surely a man with a brain as giant as yours should know that the record date does not determine who gets the dividend, that it is the ex-date that does. And how come that giant brain of yours can't comprehend that the SEC as well as all the stock exchanges says you're wrong?

    Yes, you are ignorant. You don't understand the process when due bills are used and you refuse to educate yourself. The company's statement that the Asterias shares go to shareholders of record as of May 28th is accurate but incomplete. To believe that their statement is a complete explanation of the distribution process is as stupid as reading the statement, "depress the gas pedal of a car and the car moves forward" and concluding that the car will forever go forward, never to stop again. Yet you're so secure in your ignorance that you tell me, "Know the facts before you post!"

    If only you'd take your own advice, you wouldn't look so stupid when you post your ignorant baloney.

  • Reply to

    Vii is now ex dividend, and price has firmed

    by trainspimp Jul 9, 2014 12:44 PM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 10, 2014 8:59 PM Flag

    "I contend you get dividend if you held until ex date"

    Yes, but change the word "held" to "hold" because the ex-date hasn't yet been established.

    "and dividend will be delivered to record date holders"

    Yes ...

    "who may receive a due bill if purchased after ex date"

    After the record date, not the ex-date.

    So you already know about due bills. But keep in mind that the ex-date hasn't yet been established and the reason is because the dividend is contingent upon the merger with IQinVision, which won't be happen for weeks or months.

  • Reply to

    Vii is now ex dividend, and price has firmed

    by trainspimp Jul 9, 2014 12:44 PM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 10, 2014 8:54 PM Flag

    "wrong you have to be a shareholder of VII as of the close on 7/11/14 to be entitled to the one time cash dividend."

    No, in cases of a deferred ex-date like this, the record date establishes only who the company will pay the dividend to. Beginning July 9th, all shares sold until until the close of trading on the payment date will include an attachment called a due bill which obligates the seller to forward the dividend to the buyer.

    "We could see a 60 cent haircut by Monday 7/14/14."

    If so, it won't be because of being ex-dividend, because the ex-date won't even be established unless the merger goes through.

  • Reply to

    Vii is now ex dividend, and price has firmed

    by trainspimp Jul 9, 2014 12:44 PM
    cwn600 cwn600 Jul 10, 2014 8:50 PM Flag

    No, it's not ex-dividend. Because it's conditional upon the closing of the merger with IQinVision, it must, by stock exchange rule, use a deferred ex-date. That means the ex-date will be the first trading day after the payment date. It gets all complicated with due bills, but the point is that it won't go ex until after the merger.

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