I dont worry about taxes on long positions capital gain or dividends, all in tax deferred. If you are paying taxes on dividends which support your allegedly high life style, you have made very little after taxes
Current price 12.71 down 15 cents on the day. Nothing is in straight line up or down, but eventually stock price and value have some relationship for each other (see cornerstone for lesson in price and value).
PHK at close monday 12.95 was 52% premium, pgp (at 26.19) was 80% premium. Expect to close phk short in the 10's and pgp short in the 18's. In the meantime making lots on long of peo and pci which are still relative bargains.
trade cost equal zero, many free trades each month.
And this was just one example of peo profit--actually sold first from prior long position, and bought back later. with this account, this year made 9k on 13K peo shares plus whatever dividends I got. Lots more than the $10 I would be making on this latest phk short so far. I suppose those who bought and held this for approx 2 years would be happy collecting $2.90 in divs (maybe even taxable but mine are in pension account), and losing about $2 in princpal. I dont believe the next two years would be as generous!!! After all, paying out 17% a year, on its asset value, as phk is doing today, is not an easy goal for essentially a junk bond fund--lots of it would have to come out of principal, resulting in lower principal (already down by about half since start of fund) and larger % distribution ending in a death spiral as principal is used up, if the distributions remain the same.
If the distributions are lowered, all hell would break lose from the brain dead investors who bought or were sold this with the promise and expectation of fixed "dividends"
It is still well overvalued, but at 50% premium at close, much better than pgp which was 77 premium at close. Price now phk 12.51, and pgp 25.61.
In the meantime, making lots on other trades--bought more peo today at 30.06--selling at 30.30.
While I was behind on my current phk short (including divs paid) I am now ahead at 12.51. Plan to close in the 11's.
No body has posted about the wonderful returns in the past from high premium funds--is it because the alleged returns don't exist????
There are many closed-end funds, recently cornerstone, trading at a premium whose price collapsed.
unlike value line, whose rating system worked very well in the distant past, morningstar has never claimed or proved that its rating system reflects future performance.
If this is a fools game, I must be a FOOL who is winning each time I shorted this thing.
my breakeven after divs is now 12.60. current price is 12.32--go figure.
Of course, no prices move in exactly a straight line and equity futures and foreign market at down for tomorrow.
I dont get it because what you and others are trying to tell me is that phk has magic beans (ie portfolio and management) which are worth 50% more than ordinary beans, and I dont believe in magic.
Final challenge for bp--Can you point out a single fund trading at the highest premiums (phk and pgp lately) which has ever outperformed its peers???????
Cornerstone--Nope, Gut--NOPE, DNP-nope, spain, germany, and korea funds in the 1980's nope.
The best performing fund that I had in the 1980s was japan fund at discount of 25% plus, made several 100% with div/cap gain reinvestment in just a couple of years before fund open-ended approx 1988.
And I am still ahead in phk short even after todays rise, and was well ahead on closed phk shorts.
Pdi and phk--management same pimco
Pdi and PHK--leveraged same phk 41%, pdi 47%--more leverage with pdi!
Pdi and PHK--invested in bonds and bond derivatives--same
Pdi and PHK performance--PDI is better (over its shorter life)--yahoo historical prices is more accurate than cef connect
Pdi and PHK dividends--Pdi has increased--phk is same.
Capital distributions--phk ZERO, pdi--quite a lot over its short life.
And everything you said about phk applies to pdi which is trading at a discount, which has actually increased its dividend.
Again, if you read the prospectus, the "dividend" is whatever management wants it to be. The "fixed" or "steady" distribution is NOT a reason to buy overpriced magic beans.
Cornerstone today--crf-- has a 18% distribution on current price--any takers???
Practically every sentence is wrongin comrom post
The underlying assets around $8, the price $12, the dividend is whatever management decides. (there are minimum distributions for qualified funds of actual realized profits) So far since start of the fund the "dividend" has eaten up about half of the principal since start. Until the assets are zero, the management has no incentive to pick a fight with ignorant and or foolish investors who insist on a fixed and steady distribution, regardless of whether it is earned or not.
This is NOT a bond, but a bond fund. The bonds may be trading at a premium. The fund trades at an ADDITIONAL premium of approx 50% at current price. The premium on the FUND is not the way bonds work. Many bond funds, in this environment, including some by pimco trade at a discount! The 12% "yield" is strictly arbitrary, and since the start of the fund , that "yield" has resulted in the reduction of principal by close to 50%.
Now the stock price is up today by 44 cents (3.7% including dividend) to 12.36. I said many times that the price does not go up or down in a straight line, but as you can see in cornerstone and others, sooner or later the price equals the value which is currently approx $8.50. The price is still $1 including dividend worse than it was a week ago before it started its fall.
The site cef connect would tell you, rst that phk was trading close to a zero premium till 2009. Price history tab and since inception chart. One of us is lying!!!
According to cef connect chart, the stock was trading between approx 10 % discount and 10% premium until approx 2009. You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own "facts", unless, of course, cef connect has wrong figures.
Nov 2008, discount was 17%,
Hows the beach uk?
Again, for the zillionth and one time, the "dividend" of phk is whatever management decides to pay, and they can make any decision for any reason, paying the same "dividends" even if the company looses approx half its value, as it already has since inception. If you dont believe me about "dividends" or "distributions" read the registration statement
Citi, ge, bac and others are REAL companies, PHK is merely a mutual fund in that it owns interests in other companies but has no operating business.
And at that time phk was trading at a 20% discount, not the 60% premium it reached a few days ago. But in the past two years your return was approx ZERO, including divs.
Boy, I never knew all the old posters who touted this for years had new identities on this message board.
When I mention cornerstone, I am talking about the fund when it was trading at 50 to 100% and the result of buy and holds at that time, comparing the results to buying and holding phk at 50 to 60% premiums.
I dont have a problem with cornerstone at their present prices, although there are better closed ends--peo for example imo --to invest in.
I believe phk has further down to go, but prices rarely go in a straight line.
How long have you owned cornerstone (crf?) and how is that 20% dividend working out for you?? According to cefconnect, over the last ten years the return was minus .44% per year. 2007 and 2008 each had losses of over 40%!!! But I am sure you got out at the top and bought back in at the bottom--lol But I am sure that you were happily collecting that 20% dividend over the past 10 years--lol.
Oh, well, I guess that is what happens when you wear blinders and look for "dividends" which mean nothing in managed distribution mode, even paying 100% premium. Will phk go the same way, time will tell