Are you claiming that it is NOT very easy to obtain any HLF product I want at least at a 25% discount off SRP? Because I can guarantee you I can buy them all day long at that price, if not lower.
they try to claim that a huge percentage of HLF distributors actually sign up to get the "discount". but why would you pay $59, $79, or $109 sign a lengthy distributors document, go through all the hassle..... when you can easily get the same 25% discount or more, from almost any current distributor out there? No, they sign up because they "think" they can make money retailing the product or maybe get high up in the pyramid and when they find out neither is going to happen they quit. That happens almost all the time. When will the class action lawsuits start flying specifically about the false misrepresentations around the ability to profitably retail these products. Hmmm, what if the masses that tried and failed learn they can get their money back by joining the class action because they were deceived into thinking they could retail this profitably? Bet most of them would like to get their 1k or 2k or more back.
He probably prefers his "make believe" gains to come from "make believe" long postions rather than "make believe" short positions. LOL
Anything is possible. But serious resistance is evident in the 73 area. Regardless, the upside is very limited here in the short run. The only possible catalyst is a clean audit which would remove that cloud at least. But with all the overhang and potential potholes anyone buying in here is crazy imo.
No you cant sell product at retail. Cant advertise. Can't Advertise. So, why do it? Well, here's the deal. You can charge a membership fee but that is not what it is all about either. Obviously, that isn't going to keep the doors open. But, By opening a recruiting center you can start to get people to "gather" in social context and talk about health, nutrtion and especially HLF and especially the "opportunity" to become a distributor. Give them some product, get them feeling good , maybe do some social or exercise things together and continue to pitch the merits of the HLF "opportunity". Of course you will lose money on the operation of the recruiting center but it is an excellent way to get people to "come to you" and then you can pitch the 'opportunity". The profits you eventually make with up line payments in this excellent recruiting center will more than offset the nominal losses sustained on the center itself.
1. buy this product from me at retail and you will lose weight and be healthy. Ok, that might work but if potential customers compare the products and the pricing they will soon figure out it is not competitive.
2. become a distributor (and use the products yourself) and lose weight and be healthy and get an excellent income stream by either retailing the stuff to others (wink wink that won't happen for long but might be a good recruiting tool to entice new distributors) and get rich if you can be successful at building your down line.
Obviously, sales pitch #2 is much easier and more profitable. Trying to get $1,000-3,000 out of someone with salespitch #1 is very difficult. Getting a thousand or two out of salespitch #2 works great. Forget the facts that 99% of the people you recruit into the scheme will lose money. The point is to get them to fork over a thousand or two and if only 1-2% are successful recruiters themselves you are on your way to making good money.
1. they could try to retail the stuff and make money but margins are slim and the lifetime value of a retail customer is low. Markup margins are very low and expenses are high.
2. Recruit a really good distributor below you that is really good at recruiting more distributors. Now the lifetime value of that is HUGE. Margins are huge and expenses are nil. All you have to do is keep them pumped up!! No direct solicitation of your own, no sales pitches, just keep him or her recruiting.
So, why would any distributor want retail customers? A good retail customer (who believes in the product) is a bonafide prime candidate for a down line distributor!! Work them to death until they start recruiting (other disciples) for you and then you CAN REALLY MAKE MONEY. At least 7 levels of money! Now we are talking.
Get some people below you who are all fired up about the "opportunity" Keep recruiting more people below you and KEEP them recruiting (building the pyramid) and getting people below them to become distributors and "buy product" and KEEP everyone recruiting more below them and buying product. Keep the daisy chain going at all costs. Most will drop out after buying and losing and trying, but you will find a few really good at recruiting and they are your "moneymakers"
Did you notice that selling the stuff at retail IS NOT IN THE MODEL? That is because it is totally irrelevant in the ability to make money at this scheme. Trying to retail the stuff profitably actually HURTS any distributors money making ability as it takes away from recruiting time. The money is in the recruiting and building the down line. Simple. Now go out and RECRUIT RECRUIT RECRUIT.
I should modify my last post. We do know what happens after the new recruit ships money to HLF. HLF turns around and ships about 70-80% of that money to the new recruits UP LINE. At least 7 tiers of up line. Probably many of these up line people don't even know or care that the new recruit exists because they are so far removed. Just keep sending the checks HLF. In addition, i misspoke. 99% quit after losing money.
I didn't say that your distributors (in your downline) are NOT making any money. I said they are NOT making any money retailing this stuff. If they ARE making money it is because they are good recruiters. And, of course, it is in your best interest to keep them pumped up and recruiting because everyone they recruit who orders product makes you money. A lot easier than trying to sell at retail yourself isn't it. And then you have your recruiting centers going full blast in constant give away samples, or sell at nominal fee, and recruit recruit recruit so that is another source of new recruits.
who will sell you a product at 25-35% off SRP? Very very easy. They all will do it. but then you have to listen to them continue to hype the "business opportunity" over and over. But even if you finally tell them to shove the business op talk and just sell you at 25-35% off they will do it forever to unload the stuff. That is why it is impossible to make money retailing.
that is the way it would work in a normal world, but in the bizarro world of MLM's the ONLY way to make money is to recruit your best customers to become distributors in your downline. Everyone knows they can never make any money retailing this stuff. The only way to make it is to get a bunch below you who are all in constant RECRUIT mode themselves, therefore giving you a percentage of each new recruits orders. Keep them all pumped up and buying and recruiting and you are on your way to success as a pyramid leader. What they do with the bought product is irrelevant. Most self consume, give it away to entice others into the pyramid or sell at steep discounts to get people started then go after them as down liners in the pyramid. wash rinse repeat.
I can only speak for myself. First, I don't spend countless hours but do post more on some days than others. I am interested in HLF and have made money shorting the stock but currently have no position. I like to post my ideas and see if anyone can bring legitimate arguments against them to check their validity. Usually I get sophomoric answers but sometimes I get some interesting feedback or push back to an actual idea or thought that makes sense. In addition, I truly believe that MLM's do great harm to society as a whole. I think they, or at least many of them including HLF, defraud millions of people out of their money and many of these people are poor and vulnerable. I think HLF is an abomination and agree with Billy bobs assessment as to its value to this culture and how much it will be missed if it goes away. It just ticks me off to see them getting away with what is obviously a fraud based on the totally false premise that profitable retail sales are going to happen for people joining this scheme. And since profitable retail sales don't happen then it is totally based on rising up in the pyramid which very few percentage wise can do just employing simple math. The over priced products are average at best but i really have no problem with them and if people were employed as "true direct salespeople" without the fraud based MLM I would have no problem with people promoting them and offering advice trying to help people get healthy. I agree a shake is probably better than what a lot of the obese they are targeting are currently using. Now, aren't you glad you asked?.
First of all, you are an absolute idiot if you think any posts on this thread effect the share price at all. i will clue you in...........they have absolutely NO effect. So the whole premise of your post is completely BS. Bill Ackman would not waste 10 cents trying to influence the "investors" on this board.
then right after he said all that he said to MOJ privately. " thanks for the check Mikey. You know you would think I would be rolling in the cash but actually I made squat as SG. And this extra money is really helpful. Did I read your script like you wanted? Just keep those checks coming and I will keep singing your tune!!"
I am not so sure. It could possibly be that PWC is simply dotting every i and crossing every t based on the things that Billy bob brought up to them in his letter and other issues. After all, they are not expressing opinions on the key issues such as "does the company have profitable retail sales". that is beyond the scope of audit. And why not keep filling in all the details and charging HLF high fees. They are certainly in NO position to argue about the cost.
has to be a concern for longs. Maybe it is ready to be completed and no problems will be exposed. but something certainly does not smell right with the length of time it has taken. Nah, I am sure it is nothing. Just making sure everything is in order. LOL. Longs better hope so.
Owned by a bunch of widows and orphans? Are you talking about Madoff's fund or HLF? Listen, if one is exposing a fruad the people owning the fraud are going to get hurt one way or the other. Should Madoff's fund have been allowed to continue to "protect" the widows and orphans who owned it. Ridiculous argument.