it is trading at fair value.
Read prior posts
Briefly Ford must fire on all cylinders to move up and then we are not talking big move .
Europe needs to show major improvement possibly at this point break even cause Street know how quickly losses can return.
Profit must remain Ford has warned already .
Sales in America the only driver of profits must do more then maintain
The new truck will need strong sales Truck is Fords only real profit
Economy which drives truck sales
Buy back or dividend increase Slappies here think that will drive stock up NOPE maybe a week . Ford is in to cynical an industry . Losses can mount overnight and the dividend can be cut quickly.
Not that I would mind a dividend increase.
As always I am bozothestockbroker been here since circa 2000 calling out the Mo s lil muffins and UAW shills
Nailed every move on Ford read my history . Not saying I am all knowing many mistakes just have hit Ford everytime.
Sometimes I begin to understand why you spent your life on the assembly line.
You are given thumbs down not because of the good news , which it is I agree. But because you of how you spin it. 8 out of the top ten selling cars are foreign. Ford may sell a lot of fiestas but because of the labor costs they fail to make much if any profit on the vehicle.
It is funny but just as you don't understand how labor impacts profit which the whole world gets , you fail to understand why Ford remains range bound . Ford makes almost all its profit from American sales. And that profit comes from a truck.
One day China may matter but today it does not. Europe as in England remains a major drag on profit.
The last chapter has not been written. Ford survived barely. The fact that they were a breath away from bankruptcy after years of selling millions of cars is telling. They should easily had money in the bank. Although management burned many $ wastefully . And white collar were grossly overpaid also
Even In the worst year Ford sells a lot of cars but labor costs do not allow a profit.
I hate to bust your chops. But come on the United Steel Workers did in the steal industry just like the UAW did in the big 3 albeit with managements consent , the Government would not let the Big 3 break the Union and so forth.
Just think how much it cost to run a big cargo ship from China to the US ?
And still make a profit.
AS FOR YOUR STATEMENT about UAW pensions ? What cuts took place ?
As I posted we need March sales data , got it, April sales and profit. And then and only then if everything is good news and DOW stays up will we move. Not to the extent the cheerlears think.
Now years ago along jefferson all of the worlds steel was milled.. Today it is shipped from China. The raw materials are shipped first to China , the steel is made and then shipped to US. NOW think about this the fuel cost, crew , ship cost , maintence , food for crew and on and on.
YET BECAUSE the labor cost is so much lower to make the steel it is still profitabe . How is that possible if labor does not impact the bottom line much. Why not make the steel here ?
By the way already accounted for less enviromental regulations.
I would agree with several of your points. I would again state Ford trades well within fair value. Simply because so many factors can torpedo the stock. On the other hand so much has to go right to drive the stock higher.
Of course I totally disagree on labor costs.
And from personal experience people don't work harder or better regardless of the pay .
People work because they need the job. They do what they need to do to get pay.
incentive pay is only good for commissioned sales people . Or base plus etc then a bonus is added for hitting a goal.
the endless insanity of this poster goes on and on. As do so many mutual fund investors.
When the stock goes up it is not manipulation
But when it does not perform for rational reasons it is manipulation
Who owns the most Ford large institutions don't they want it to go up ?
The Ford family billionaires connected every which way , why don't they stop the manipulation ?
The reason Ford has traded in the range which I have called for years and have listed below again
There profits are driven by one product a truck , 8 out of ten of the best selling cars are foreign .
UAW labor costs remain high and there going higher , we seen this movie over and over .
Lessons learned not really white collar costs ,bonus etc pay out of line
Pensions , what industry pays a pension anymore , even States are cutting
COMPETITION way to much
Commodity product , brand loyalty is gone except to Japanese faithful . Friend just bought a C , sold his F
Brother just sold his Caddy bought a BMW , young buyers 35 under will switch anytime unlike my Father who bought 5 Oldsmobile's in a row , Uncle 5 Buicks
Europe Ford is yet to break even let alone make a profit
Unstable economy , Mc Donalds economy they don't buy cars out of want
High auto sales Do NOT CONTINUE forever they will slack off. Ford did not make a big run during this time what happens when sales slow
Ford is trading near or at fair value simply put.
Could it move to 20 if profit continue yes, sales continue yes, Europe Yes one thing goes wrong kablloyee
But after 20 where is upside ?
UAW contract will be a give away .
Nothing you said is wrong. But I would take issue with the 52 week number . Ford fell back big time from 18 s and fell to what 14.50 so calling this a gain is somewhat misleading. Of course if your not a long term holder as everybody here claims to be made and you bought and sold you are doing fine.
You know I owned 1500.00 shares of Oracle at 25 rode it down during all the crashes. Sold it when I had a small profit.
Something like 15 years later it is not 41 . I still have 100 shares in my IRA .
So if I held the other shares what loss opportunity did I lose ?
Did Bill Ford say how much the cost of producing a vehicle was reduced from the concessions? No? Why wouldn't he to show how much more efficient the company is
WHAT IS THIS SUPPOSE TO MEAN ? Nobody disagrees companies is more efficient. What does that change about my argument of labor costs be they work rules, pension, hourly wages , benefits.
Again you argue simply from an emotional point of view.
I can tell you that most of the people in my UNION could be replaced by people at half the salary.
Yes I am Union . Yes where I started the job was miserable. I moved up.
Try 6 days on rotating days off. Holidays you work. Ask for a day off denied. Maybe 12 weekends off a year.
Once again I have to wonder about you. I answered a post about me and a topic Mo addressed to me.
I never said I am going to not attack when attacked.
In fact I meant to mention that when you first brought it up.
You never address MO constant nonsense and personal attacks.
Yes indeed they screwed the stock holder right and left by selling out the farm. Just before Ford stock dropped the new contract was negotiated.
I STATED ON THIS BOARD THE CONTRACT WAS Very bad.
The idiots like MO were jumping up and down.
The stock immediately fell as the Street was like pay raises ?????? how so ?
The excec , white collar and UAW made out .
ARE YOU KIDDING YOURSELF with a proper labor contract Ford could easily make 3000 more a car times how many sales
Please stop spouting UAW nonsense that labor costs do not matter.
YOU know why TOYOTA kicked butt their cars cost way less to produce and they sold them for less.
YOU know why I bought my 3 #$%$anese cars because the cost was 5 k less then the Corvette . I bought a 280Z, 280ZX 300 ZX they were fun ,great cars. The babes loved them the guys on the Street loved, the valet parked in the premium spot.
YOU know what I wanted a Vette the Vette was a better car but price caused me to go #$%$. The difference in price the Vette was not worth 5 k more. WHY did it cost 5 k more LABOR COSTS
Stay on topic Mo. Labor costs . Even Bill Ford finally admitted the UAW saved us [for now] by what inventing a new product, advertising, building a better car ?
NO ,NO, NO they simply made concessions be they hourly cost, pension , health they made LABOR COST CONCESSIONS .
SO stop posting stupid statements like you never worked on the line like me. Most if not all economic advisors to FORD never worked the line.
A moron such as you can work the line , WE GET IT but you cant be an engineer , or anything else for that matter.
What if I told you at my job 11 years ago we worked without a Supervisor . Today we may have 4 Supervisors, 1st line ., 4 called second line , a watch commander and under him several people .
Nothing about the job has changed except technology has improved to eliminate much of what the one supervisor did 10 years ago if one was on duty.
YOU HAVING NEVER WORKED MY JOB, Never had a class about my job [I have multiple economic classes where the Big 3 was dissected] YOU KNOW WHAT THOUGH
I BET YOU COULD DRAW A CONCLUSION JUST ON WHAT I TOLD YOU THAT SOMETHING IS WRONG .
Once again auto assembly work depending on the job may be back breaking, mentally draining or ____ . That does not mean many would not ,could not do it for a reasonable wage that you might not accept. Or would you ? Remember the Gannett Detroit News strike ? Guess what happened and how wages fell.
They are saying incentive spending is going up . March sales lacking. Incentive around 3300 per car. Imagine a reasonable wage hourly of 14 hour . Eliminate pensions as in almost every job today in the US . Federal style health benefits .
That 3300 would be covered and the bottom line would be what is needed. Mark my words and remember when the US auto industry collapses again be it 10 years or 15 it will.
Watch the Ford contract be touted as holding the line as labor costs rise again.
And the white collar gains as the UAW holds the Big 3 hostage again.
And the they give in because they are profitable.
Eventually as we already are heading that way car sales will drop, another recession will come , and they will lose billions fast.
You presume I never worked a terrible, hard job . I worked 60 to 70 hours straight commission . No sitting . Carrying furniture in a suit . And at the end of the week some people were in the negative after gas for driving to work.
My brother worked in a shop while working his way through college.
Assembly line work . I will ask him if it was Union.
Tuff work but as he said mindless, basically simple work. Some skill involved.Midnight shift .
Great pay circa 1979. Today I am sure the work is done overseas .
While millions of Americans would love to do the job for 12 bucks and hour , medical, a small pension. Instead of working at Mc Donalds.
It is not about would I do it for 13 bucks and hour. It is about the thousands of people that could do it for 13 and hour. Just as capable as the one that are doing it now.
Don't tell me what is needed I worked the Plymouth road area for years.
Watched the Ford plant workers hit the liquor stores . Smoke the mj and who knows what else.