I am not sure if you just play dumb to further your agenda or are really incapable of understanding basic economics.
There is nobody except a few communist professors who support the idea that labor did not kill the big 3
I have cited countless studies and articles filled with expert opinions. From University of Michigan, Yale, MIT, Harvard , Wallstreet Journal, Barrons, Detroit News, Free Press, Time, Newsweek ,U.S.News and on and on.
Did the Big 3 make mistakes that led to less PROFIT absoulutly . But that does not change the fact that as I have pointed out endlessly and you never answer
Ford always sales enough product even in bad years they just do not make enough profit on controllable costs[labor] 3 million vehicles sold 30 billion lost
Fords sales in any given year should yield a profit if labor costs are correct
Even you point this out not intenially by stating UAW conssessions savedthe Company and led to record pofts
That is funny how so often you and THE UAW tell us that .
In fact it is the mantra of the contract complaints
We by our conssessions bailed/saved Ford
According to you labor costs are really not a factor in profit . Then how could the UAW have saved Ford with conssessions ?
It is the difference between 15 and hour and 28 where profit is made.
Several workers interviewed by The Wall Street Journal say the labor proposal doesn’t go far enough to roll back concessions made by the union to help the No. 2 U.S. auto maker survive during periods of financial distress
YOU CANNOT HAVE IT BOTH WAYS LABOR COSTS DO NOT MATTER IN YOUR POSTS
YET [did not have time to find a better quote] EVERY ARGUMENT by UAW is OUR labor costs cuts saved FORD.
AND NOW THE RAISES will destroy them again.
Stop bringing knifes to gun fights.
When I predicted this I always thought to myself , no way can it really happen.
7 to 10 years of lessons learned undone.
incentives, fat UAW contract , bonus , elimination of the Tiers
utter insanity .
I just hope we get a suckers rally so I can get out .
Hit my posts button = and show me where I have been wrong on Ford,
I warned about the 150 not driving the stock price
I told you the UAW would clobber F on the contract
I said Ford had one final run left and when we ran to 18 I asked is this it ?
I asked that question again and said we better move before the UAW contract
I STILL HOPE WE GET A SUCKERS RUN
Ford has 2 maybe 3 quarters to show big profits or their done as to stock price
Not only will this contract cause a repeat of the past it is exactly what I said
Insane bonus , insane raises, end of the second Tier , worse, deals to stay in US
Remember anything the UAW gets the rest of Ford gets for the most part
There is no way Ford stays profitable once record sales end, something goes wrong somewhere in the world
The endless march of the Foreign auto as they gain and gain and honestly nobody is going to pay up so the UAW can feast Americans will continue to buy foreign .
BSTAURREY you are starting to post like you did a few years ago . you are not making any sense at all.
You complain about Ford . Yet you think instead of the needed Third Tier the wages should increase.
If that is the case you should be loading up on Ford stock at these prices.
Ford is earning profits and why worry if auto sales drop to 14 million units .
After all Ford only lost 30 billion on sales of 3 million .
As I said forever Ford always sells enough cars they just fail to make a profit because of labor costs.
Actually from Questionater bizzare reasoning why not raise the wages to 150 and hour the workers will have more to spend on Chinese ,Korean, Viet , Japenese , Indian goods etc. Oh the UAW does not care about the people who use to make T.V. Radios, furniture , computers, sports equitment , candels ,tools, steel and on and on.
EVERYONE GETS IT
"Officials at Ford see the template set by GM and Fiat Chrysler as being more generous than expected, and have told UAW officials that an agreement patterned off its rivals’ deals will likely shift a big portion of the auto maker’s investment plans away from U.S. factories, people directly involved in these negotiations said"
As usual the comedy of you Mo and the other UAW shills never stops.
How much of the 18 million CAR sales did Ford capture ?
7 of the top 7 cars are foreign,
The jauggernut will continue,
Hunydi is entering the lux mkt , what share can Lincoln afford to lose.
Without a Third Tier the US auto is sunk.
Funny you get the usual thumbs down from the Pumping 5 Questionater, flying ,lilmuffin, etc
There really are not any investing posters left here because of the political garbage.
I hope you believe me now that MO at best is insane I mean clinically . Questionater, Flying, LoveLincolns
do not give a hoot about Ford there simply UAW shills all that is left on the board. Ask yourself why is Questionater who routinly knocks GM product on the GM board pumping UAW pay raises. He certainly does not own GM stock. NOR do these guys own any Ford stock. Heck my big shot brother in law only owns what GM gives him. They know the reality. IF Questionater and the others believed in Ford and actually knew something they would be mortgaging the house. They know Ford is not seeing 30 with this contract in place.
Every now and again I see a post buy someone knew maybe they bought 100 shares they are soon gone
THE BIGKAHUNA is a short but one of the best posters when he comes around
HE TOTALLY EXPOSED MO , Mo would not even answer after a few rambling, inane posts which did not make a lick of sense about the BigK.
Please pull up my posts over the last 2 -3 years and you will understand the WHY
Breifly Ford make almost all of its profit from 1 product the 150
Earning 250 for a car because of high labor costs is insane /not substainable
7 of the top 7 selling cars are foreign .THAT is self EXPLANATORY
The expectaions for the 150 were ludicrius SEE my posts prior to launch ,during/after some estimate put profit loss at 1 billion this year
The 150 may be the best truck on the mkt but except for die hard fans most are not going to pay a big priemum over the GM or C product
The whole vehicle mkt[which F really only gets trucks some SUV] has been record making this does not continue forever.
FORD KNOWS how bad this UAW contract will be to the bottom line so thier trying to pad the numbers of sales ,
Remember the people in control win no matter what ,it is just HOW much they $$$$ win is the difference. Even Jack Nassar ended up with a high paying job after is demise total failure at Ford.
The man who s claim to fame was bankrupcy ended up as the supposed savior at KMART and finished the job there taking them to bankrupcy . And would soon get another job.
Ford is where it is at becuse of the UAW contract ,we went from hoping for a Third Tier to a return to yesterday
Also big investors knew weeks if not months ago Ford was going to launch incentives
And the reality which I said all along the 150 was not a Grand Slam
A billion in profits estimated was lost. Many future customers who may not return
And possibly mkt share
There was virtully A STATEMENT I MADE ALL ALONG the 150 could deliever all that was promised
Not saying it is a bad product just did we gain anything ??????
Again we disagree . Nobody deserves a raise . Mkt value determines the wage or should
Lets open jobs to non Union workers and see how many we can fill .
Then start training to replace the non skill positions
That would be free mkt not strangle hold of UAW which will lead us to bankrupcy.
420 million and more cause everyone else will be getting bonus not substainable
You are joking right ? Read the new is was a rumor a week ago but a solid one. It was confirmed over 3 days ago.
Of course it is self evident they are sacrificing margins ,where do you think the $ is coming from ?
Add the new UAW contract and watch out below at some point when margins fall
This is WHY FORD TRADES AT WHERE IT DOES
There is no whole. There is no return to 1 or 2 American autos with a third making less dominating this business.
There is no allure for 85 to 90 % of the market . A car is a car is a car.
The car is not a new thing like it was in the 40s, and into the 50s
There is not amazing inovation to a generation that has cell, computers like air conditioning was to a buyer in the 60s and power windows and etc
The only glamour mkt is owned by Lexus ,BMW, Mercedes
THERE IS NO RETURN TO YESTERDAY well there is when this new contract leads to losses.
That is hilarious ! This and the UAW contract is what every expert warned us about 5 years ago.
The past is simply repeating.
Please if I am lucky enough to get out at 17
Let me buy you a beer when the bankrupcy comes in next 10 years, You are in Mi right.
248 979 8868
a way to get market share back that was lost during the F-150 retool
INSANITY the whole idea wasnot to lose mkt share because of the launch or the theory it would be made up without incentives
I SAID NEVER HAPPEN commodity product 150 or a Chry or a GM truck all about the same except for a die hard fan .
It will not break the compay yet , it will just start the process
Pay this type of money in a low margin commodity business.
NOTHING has been learned from the past !
Ford has not gained anything in mkt share
The foreign jauggernut continues.
The 150 may produce a bit more profit than in the past but that will wane by second half if not sooner 2016
THE CULTURAL SHIFT is here, two more friends bought Audis and BMW converted from Caddys/Lincoln
All buyers from Big 3 familys
SAD but true ,
THE ONLY QUESTION is can you get out at 17s ???????
And how and insane person like MO and UAW shills like Questionater, Lilmuvffin, Flying
Show their face on and investor board here and GM
This is getting a bit scary . Did you see that they are launching mass incentives ? All in the year that was suppose to be driven by high profit margins . Next up the UAW contract where everything is being given back. You did not believe me on that one either.
Always remember 30 billion lost in 3 years on 3 million in car sales
WHAT HAVE I ALWAYS SAID HERE do as I say not as I Do .
This time I am listening to my own advise
If we get any run up I am out.
There is nobody in their right mind that can believe that with the new contract , the unknown economy [many say it is a joke] incentive spending, Europe who knows still not even a break even.,
That Ford should do better than it is now in 2018 , 2019 .
MO, Flying, Questionater, Jeff,Lilmuffin and the rest
Do not own the stock or very little of it they are simply shilling for the UAW
Final note Alan was no genius , Fields is not bad, not good. Alan did what he did at Boeing and everyone said anyway cut LABOR costs , cut all costs [I know so many people white collar who got booted ,[they were over bloated] cut platforms.
Get big Goverment incentives 4k turn in your old car , low interest loans from G ,
Eventually the US economy turned
COCENSUS IS ONLY 17
Ford was near bankrupcy, GM, C did go bankrupt. All 3 have less and less of the US car market
And now in 3 to 7 years the advantage of a two Yier will be gone.
Sales will not continue forever actually what part of 17 million does F really get ?
And how will we not be right back where we were ?
The deal would provide an $8,000 signing bonus upon ratification, bring newer workers the same health care coverage as their more senior coworkers and bring wages of those hired after October 2007 to parity over three to seven years with those hired before that date.
They missed the first 90 days of the second half. Europe still lost money . As I predicted the last five years check my posts.
Incentives coming so the rumor goes.
The UAW is getting raises and bonus showing Ford cannot/will not change anything from the past
30 billion lost in 3 years on sales of 3 million cars .
Whats next , wait till 2017 earnings ?
This is starting to look like the past repeating itself. Record profits followed by record losses.
I suggest out of every UAW paycheck once a month 100 shares of F is purchased at closing price as part of their pay deal .
Afterall why would Questionater,Mo, Flying, Jeff, Lovelincolns object if F is going to the moon let alone 20
And remember boys,girls labor cost do not matter.
Off the medication again . Poor Mo a man who pretends he invested in F at 3 . Well maybe a hundred shares and now has been wrong for the last 5 years . At best a UAW shill at worse a mental case escaped from the Northville Mi mental hospitial.
I am not sure of your point ? The only "experts' who do not tie the demise of the US auto to high labor costs are the UAW paid ones And these are few and far between.
It is simple math what bonus payments to 40k workers, raises of even 4.00 dollars and hour times, 40k X 40 hours a week will do to FORD. Add the fact that you have to pay bonus to all the white collar workers and givve them raises.
Add this to the undeniable growth of foreign product outside of the 150
Now tell me how Ford will raise the price of their product ? Actually what is the rumor about Ford about to launch hugh incentive spending ?
Will the UAW Bury GM in Upcoming Negotiations?
Will history repeat itself with GM eventually driven to a second bankruptcy if the UAW is successful in raising labor costs at the automaker? The stage seems to be set for the UAW to further put unionized automakers at a disadvantage to automakers with lower labor costs in a very competitive industry. The current US hourly labor cost at GM is already one of the highest in the industry at $58 per hour. That compares to the US wages at Toyota and Volkswagen of $48 and $38 per hour, respectively.
According to a Reuter’s article, the increased labor cost at GM (as well as at Ford) translates to about an additional $250 in cost per vehicle. That is an obstacle that can be overcome during an industry peak, which we are currently in. However, the higher labor costs are one of the reasons that profit margins remain thin at GM, even during the top of the sales cycle which has seen record sales for automakers. When the inevitable sales slow-down comes for the industry, it is likely that GM will burn through whatever remains of its taxpayer-supplied “cash hoard.”
bigkahuna1333 • Jan 30, 2015 4:27 PM Flag
Tell ya what---read the 5 pages on Moes credibility and really all the long time longs here and their prognostications. Fly, Lincoln, muffin, Jeffegg---they are ALL in the same boat with their predictions. a MASSIVE amount of times to be wrong. I can't help it if you want to be blind and name call. That's for children. Less
The BIG Kahuna posted 5 years of Mo and MO was never right in a single post
MO never answered other than to put Big K on ignore.
later I post some of MO worst predictions.
The reality is fly, jeff, Mo, questionater do not own any Ford stock they are UAW shills.