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Energy Transfer Partners, L.P. Message Board

lizahuang54321 59 posts  |  Last Activity: Jul 5, 2014 3:20 PM Member since: Mar 20, 2010
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  • Reply to

    Where is the dividend?

    by grnavarre Jun 9, 2014 4:05 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Jun 12, 2014 1:46 PM Flag

    I guess you don't actually follow this trust then otherwise you would know the answer to that silly question.
    Try reading the press releases.

  • Reply to

    Stock will only payout $35 in future dividends

    by yurivelarde Jun 18, 2014 9:39 AM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Jun 18, 2014 3:55 PM Flag

    Not sure about your math (I expect the trust will pay more than that), however the chargeable costs issue is real and known by anyone who bothers to look at the trust document. Of course, most here prefer to invest blind and would rather buy without knowing what they are buying than to spend an hour doing research. I have pointed out the costs escalation (written into the trust terms) for several years now. Yes, starting in 2017-18 timeframe there will be a sharp drop in distributions with that drop extending each year. Depending on oil prices in that timeframe, trust distributions could indeed go to zero decades before the trust terminates. Of course that will make the trust units almost worthless as units in a declining trust that doesn't pay distributions are inherently of no value.

    Again, I'm not sure on your math. I haven't constructed a model but I would guesstimate remaining distributions more like in the $50 range (could even pay the $35 before the escalation in costs kicks in) which is still half the current unit price, so I am not disputing your overall conclusion.

  • Reply to

    Predicating the "life time" for trusts

    by wrgrace88888 Apr 9, 2014 9:44 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 13, 2014 2:59 PM Flag

    They are all different although there are a few different models. You need to look at the prospectus to find out the details. It can be found on the SEC website. Actually WHX will end in one year from now. SDR is also a limited lifetime trusts. NDRO and ROYT on the other hand are perpetual trusts. That doesn't mean they last forever, rather it means the termination will occur when there is insufficient reseres left to continue economically rather than having a pre-defined termination criteria.

  • Reply to

    You've been had!

    by torahlover0117 Jun 3, 2014 4:56 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Jun 3, 2014 9:25 PM Flag

    Your 'analysis' only applies if you think it is a reasonable investment to just get your money back in 8 years with no profit (in other words give someone an interest free 8 year loan). I guess you are new at this investing lark, huh?

  • Reply to

    ** write the S.E.C. **

    by bbx3ww Jun 18, 2014 12:36 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Jun 18, 2014 2:04 PM Flag

    I guess you think the trust should also be barred from publishing annual reports and issuing press releases since that is where the article's information came from. The trust has been telling you this for years now if you bothered to pay attention to your investments.

  • Reply to

    Lawsuit distribution

    by flowanderer Apr 23, 2014 4:09 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 23, 2014 5:26 PM Flag

    I understand what you are saying but that is always the case with stocks. You sell and you lose whatever payout will come in future. Think of the chaos it would be otherwise...any bad news and you have to claw back profits from previous owners. Anytime a company goes bankrupt anyone who used to own it but already sold have to give back their would be completely unworkable. That kind of argument would not stand a chance.

  • Reply to

    xom and xto's roll

    by joemerk Apr 24, 2014 8:13 AM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 24, 2014 11:53 AM Flag

    "How will they handle trust business and lawsuits going forward."

    XOM/XTO do not 'handle trust business'.
    HGT only collects a royalty payment on oil and gas produced on the trust properties.
    As for being held liable, they just were.

  • Company Focusing Capital on Other Projects in Its Large, Diverse Portfolio of Growth Opportunities

    Williams (NYSE:WMB) has suspended capital investments in the Bluegrass Pipeline, a proposed natural-gas-liquids project, primarily in response to an insufficient level of firm customer commitments. The company continues to engage in discussions with potential customers regarding the scale and timing of demand for services and the required firm contractual commitments that would support any future capital investments.

    The project, in which Williams is a joint-venture partner, is designed to connect natural gas liquids produced in the Marcellus-Utica areas in the U.S. Northeast with domestic and export markets in the U.S. Gulf Coast. The Bluegrass Pipeline represents a strong long-term solution in the marketplace.

  • Reply to

    long way to go...

    by joemerk Apr 23, 2014 1:03 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 24, 2014 1:58 PM Flag

    Why would feelings enter into it?
    If developing the wells is in XTO/XOM interests then they will do it.
    If not, then they won't.
    XTO/XOM is not making any decisions based on what is beneficial for the trust.
    All this discussion seems to take the view that XTO is somehow working for or on behalf of the trust. That is not the case at all. The trust simply collects a royalty from whatever production on their properties the operator decides to make based on their own interests. XTO does not have any responsibility to the trust other than paying them correct royalties (which the arbitration decision concluded they had not been doing).

  • Reply to

    Stock will only payout $35 in future dividends

    by yurivelarde Jun 18, 2014 9:39 AM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Jun 18, 2014 10:52 PM Flag

    OK, well I certainly don't agree with those oil price projections which is why my guesstimate differs from your model. But we are agreed that the current price is well overvalued in relation to future distributions.

  • lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Jun 17, 2014 12:48 PM Flag

    It is surely possible however oil price spiking much higher would send the world into deep recession and that is not what us oil bulls want. Oil price is fine right now...oil companies can make enough money to be able to invest in new production while the price is not high enough to kill the global economy. But $20 higher it would be a different story. I am the biggest oil bull on this board but I do not want to see oil at $150. Do you not remember what followed the last time that happened?

  • Reply to

    High quality problem

    by fuzzier_joe Apr 11, 2014 11:48 AM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 13, 2014 2:27 PM Flag

    a retirement account allows covered calls.
    Just speak to your broker and get options approval.

  • Reply to

    long way to go...

    by joemerk Apr 23, 2014 1:03 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 24, 2014 1:53 PM Flag

    "My question is do I as a unit holder want someone that just tried to rake us over the coals working in may behalf. "

    XTO are not working on your behalf or the trust's behalf.
    XTO/XOM are working on their own behalf and the trust simply collects a royalty on the production/sales.
    To answer the previous question, if the wells are sufficiently economical (given their prioritization of their inventory of drilling possibilities) then they will keep them flowing. If not, then not. The benefot or not to the trust does not enter into their decision.
    People here are thinking backwards and assuming the operators are doing work based on the interests of the trusts. They will do what is in their interests and if those interests include producing from trust properties then the trust collects a royalty. If not, then not.

  • Reply to

    Dividend Questions

    by hulcal Apr 7, 2014 3:39 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 13, 2014 11:13 AM Flag

    You can get it all back subject to limits on the ratio of your foreign and domestic assets.
    I had some carryovers for a few years but eventually have got all my foreign taxes credited.

  • Reply to


    by racehorse9 May 8, 2014 3:33 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 May 8, 2014 4:48 PM Flag

    read the headlines...quarterly results below expectations and the CEO quit.
    Not really surprising the price dropped sharply.

  • Reply to

    When did K1s go out?

    by dorkymcirish Apr 4, 2014 7:59 AM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 13, 2014 2:54 PM Flag

    I'm talking about the handling of distributions.
    And also your gains if you collected distributions during your holding period.
    ROYT distributions consist of royalties, hedge income, maybe some small amount of interest, deductions for admin expenses, severance tax and depletion.
    If you collected distributions and then sold there is recapture for the depletion you claimed to be reported on form 4797.
    Chances are the brokerage 1099 may not include all of this or may incorrectly report your distributions as qualified dividends.
    I don't know how good Interactive Brokers are at the tax reporting,.

  • Reply to

    eroc friday

    by tek55 Apr 25, 2014 8:06 AM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 25, 2014 5:39 PM Flag

    Why should it take off? It's pretty unlikely to be re-instated at the same level.
    If they re-instate at say 10c /qtr and using a 12% yield, that would give a target price in the low $3s.

  • Reply to

    Old Timers

    by plan.maestro Apr 24, 2014 7:27 PM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 25, 2014 5:33 PM Flag

    Distribution will probably be re-instated.
    But at the same level as before? Probably not.
    Look for them to 'reinstate' with a lower distribution level.

  • Reply to

    huge oneok dividend increase

    by fdchitown Apr 18, 2014 12:25 AM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 18, 2014 2:22 PM Flag

    It's not news - they announced their new dividend policy many months ago.

  • Reply to


    by lfnv1 Apr 9, 2014 10:22 AM
    lizahuang54321 lizahuang54321 Apr 13, 2014 3:11 PM Flag

    This makes absolutely no sense.
    Trusts have zero debt so how can they ever default.
    You are talking gibberish.

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