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Inergy, L.P. Message Board

marklibera 291 posts  |  Last Activity: 5 hours ago Member since: Aug 14, 2007
  • marklibera marklibera Aug 14, 2014 10:37 AM Flag

    On the conf call, an analyst was the one who mentioned this announcement. You hope he knew what he was talking about. The question is whether EVEP will piggyback along with the other partners if they are selling or whether they think they will get more money down the line (where have we heard that before). They seemed to think the optimal time to sell would be next year, but their partners may disagree.

  • marklibera marklibera Aug 14, 2014 9:15 AM Flag

    Found it. Seems to indicate that it is a sale, otherwise how could they be buying 34% for $540mm?

  • Reply to

    $6.50 valuation

    by marklibera Aug 13, 2014 10:26 AM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 5:55 PM Flag

    My apologies. You are correct that the subordination period for SDR has not yet ended. I got SDR and SDT mixed up.

  • Reply to

    ot mark mep

    by shuching4 Aug 13, 2014 1:15 PM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 5:50 PM Flag

    SC, I just took a look. There's always an opportunity in new MLP with dropdown possibilities from parents. If they can start putting up mid-double digit distribution increases then the yield will come down. Since the first dropdown was funded with all debt, I suspect that they will use stock for the next one and present an spo opportunity. On the other hand, the basins that they are in don't really excite me. I already have Barnett exposure with APL and CMLP. Have not heard much about East Texas. It has moved up in price so someone likes it and its opportunities. Maybe when I switch out of CMLP. With the EPB purchase by KMI, I don't want to have too many MLP sales this year. Keep the ideas coming. There's far too many stocks for any one person to spot for opportunities.

  • Reply to

    Looking for a dividend increase...

    by mrock3754 Aug 6, 2014 12:35 PM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 4:01 PM Flag

    The REIT dividend requirement is based on their taxable earnings which are determined differently from the GAAP earnings that they disclose in their earnings and SEC reports. You can't just take their quarterly earnings number and say they will pay 90% of that.

  • marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 3:31 PM Flag

    They also mentioned that Total is selling their interest in the midstream and they have piggyback rights. Then an analyst mentioned that Access had announced a sale of their interest in the midstream ( I can't find any announcement of this by Access). So it looks like the midstream is getting monetized, maybe sooner than they would have liked. If they do sell, they will have a gain and it might be hard to do a like-kind exchange to defer taxes unless they buy more midstream assets, which I wouldn't think they would.

  • Reply to

    Dilution

    by ncarbitrator Aug 12, 2014 4:55 PM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 1:07 PM Flag

    Since you are interested in the water aspect of fracking, you may want to consider Antero's (AR) IPO of their midstream unit, Antero Midstream Resources, when it comes public. They have a big water supply business in the Utica and Marcellus. They have been in registration with the SEC but because the IRS has postponed all private letter rulings on what constitutes qualified income for MLP purposes, they can't bring it public yet.

  • Reply to

    trade bbep for qre?

    by andrewulsaker Aug 13, 2014 11:06 AM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 12:45 PM Flag

    Andrew (or fish), the ALDW loss will be a capital loss and so you won't get to use it to offset any ordinary income gain due to your sale of BBEP (but the cap loss can offset the cap gain). I understand your point about not letting taxes override a decision based on fundamentals. I once lost a massive gain in NRGP (the gp of NRGY) when it was acquired in a stock deal when the NRGY stock that I received went south. But here, you just exchanged BBEP stock for more BBEP stock to try to capture an apparent arb that may wilt away by the time the deal closes.

  • Reply to

    trade bbep for qre?

    by andrewulsaker Aug 13, 2014 11:06 AM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 11:59 AM Flag

    I would think twice about trying to arb MLP mergers if you are trading in a taxable account. By selling your BBEP, you now have a tax bill which includes a recapture at ordinary income tax rates plus a capital gain, offset by any passive losses that you can apply. You can go to BBEP's site and plug in your numbers to try to estimate what your tax liability on this sale may be. The merger announcement says it is tax free to QRE shareholders.
    There may have been an easier way to try to capture any arb by using options instead of selling your BBEP. In the end, you are going to end up with BBEP shares perhaps at a slightly lower basis than what they were currently trading at (when they are issued upon the merger, they could end up declining in price), but that lower basis may be offset by the tax bill you will pay.

  • Reply to

    $6.50 valuation

    by marklibera Aug 13, 2014 10:26 AM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 11:41 AM Flag

    I hope by now you understand how the distribution (it's not a dividend) is determined. If not, you really should do some research. Hint, the trust is a depleting trust and the subordination period has ended, meaning those units will share in next quarter's distribution.

  • marklibera by marklibera Aug 13, 2014 10:26 AM Flag

    From Dan Moore's article.

  • Reply to

    wells remaining to be drilled

    by dga749 Aug 8, 2014 2:03 PM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 9:30 AM Flag

    rogere, there are over 11.6mm sub units or about one-third of the commons, so once the subordination period ends, the distribution will be cut by one-third. You are correct that the "inputs" are decline in production, price and effect of hedges running off. I think you are also right about getting $4 over the next 2 years. Plenty of people have modeled out the cashflows and attempted to discount them back to get a range of values.
    The real wildcard is what does CHK do with their units. As I mentioned, they value them at $7 in their SEC reports. They aren't getting any distributions now. Once the subordination period ends, I would expect them to start selling if the market price is still above that value. So the real risk is that you wake up and CHK dumps a block (Sandridge did this on their trusts and that was a big sign that things were going south).
    I think you never really "catch up" unless the market price unexpectedly jumps, and then only if you sell and take that gain, since it tends to disappear. The only way to make up seems to be averaging down when the price falls after the ex-date, but only if you time it correctly. Without Yahoo carrying Seeking Alpha articles, there seems to be less volatility in the shares, so there might not be the wide swings that there used to be after the ex-date.
    PER was holding up much better than SDR and SDT and even spiked close to $13, but then reversed course.

  • Reply to

    Ex date on Tues Aug 12

    by marklibera Aug 11, 2014 4:40 PM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 9:06 AM Flag

    Suggest you read up on investopedia or another site to learn how record holders are determined. Hint, trades take 3 days to settle.

  • Reply to

    OT calculating my cost basis for KMI shares

    by jerseyvinny2 Aug 11, 2014 10:24 AM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 9:03 AM Flag

    Vin, Fidelity has gotten much better with handling K-1's over the last few years. I don't think any of my MLP distributions were erroneously reported on a 1099 by them last year. I haven't reached the zero cost basis on any of my MLPs yet, so I can't say how they reported or how Turbo Tax deals with it. I'm assuming that if I reach those levels that the Turbo Tax will deal with it appropriately. Plenty of posters on the i.v. board who address these tax issues during tax season.
    The brokers now have to report all sales of MLPs, whereas before MLPs were not covered securities, and as a result, this required some working around to get the basis correct and the amount of ordinary income versus cap gain correct, so that the reporting by the broker matched Turbo Tax. This is why I try to limit the number of MLP sales each year.

  • marklibera marklibera Aug 13, 2014 8:53 AM Flag

    $2.7mm plus legal.

  • Reply to

    OT calculating my cost basis for KMI shares

    by jerseyvinny2 Aug 11, 2014 10:24 AM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 12, 2014 5:12 PM Flag

    Vin, I assume you mean that you are going to get shares of KMI in exchange for KMP shares. In which case, your basis in the KMI shares will be provided by KMI (you may have to call your broker and give them the KMI info) and should equal the exchange ratio times the value set for KMI on the exchange date. You will have a gain as your KMP will be treated as a sale. You can go to the website for KMP's K-1's and plug in the numbers to estimate how much gain and ordinary income you are going to have, but it doesn't account for this year's results and for any passive losses that you may have built up.

  • Well there you go. Savings of 1 point. Better than a sharp stick in the eye. Would have hoped for a little better rate.

  • Reply to

    Ex date on Tues Aug 12

    by marklibera Aug 11, 2014 4:40 PM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 12, 2014 3:36 PM Flag

    yes, that's why the stock traded "ex-div" today.

  • Reply to

    o/t BWP, APL, ETE

    by madmax19471952 Aug 11, 2014 6:46 PM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 12, 2014 3:35 PM Flag

    Sarge, I would be careful with anything that Cramer recommends. He is clearly riding the surge in interest in the sector because of the Kinder consolidation. The reasons for the Kinder deal have been well detailed. When you evaluate companies to be bought out, they have to have something that is in need by the other market participants. And the buyers have to be able to swallow the target. Today, the need is for midstream -- both access to the shale fields where the oil, gas and NGLs are found and the delivery of the different liquids to where they are needed, whether that is to different areas of the country or for export. Just looking quickly at BWP's footprint, I don't see anything special that a competitor needs.
    That being said, now that BWP cut their distribution to 10 cents, they could clearly increase it, maybe up to 40 cents which could get you to a $26 share price in time based on a 6% yield. But I don't think anyone is going to buy them.

  • Reply to

    cramer

    by bobbyjopro Aug 11, 2014 6:36 PM
    marklibera marklibera Aug 12, 2014 3:16 PM Flag

    The calculation is based on the incremental dollar of distributable cash after the next level is reached. I believe the next level at which ATLS's percentage of the distributon increases is after ARP pays 60 cents per quarter to unitholders (ARP is currently at .1966 per month or $0.589 per quarter). So once ARP pays 60 cents per quarter (there are 74mm units per quarter plus the 2% GP take), on the next dollar of distribution, ATLS would get 48% plus 2% for its GP share.

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