The fact is, if UPS takes the charge, it costs them 3.8 billion. If they don't the cost is higher. In 2007. UPS owed it's pension plan 2.7 billion. Today, it owed Central States 3.8 Billion and Teamsters $8 billion. Goodbye Charlie
What the word "charge" means is a play on earnings. It's actually cumulative investment losses. Their main plan has $8 billion in cumulative ;losses. If UPS were to recognise that their ROA is actually 3% and not the 8.75% they CLAIM, they'd have an additional $8 billion charge and their annual contribution for take down EPS by about $2 a share.
UPS isn't earning money. It's all just smoke, mirrors and actuarial science
haha. You know I'm short UPS. By the way, the gold Krugerrands that I keep in my safe have outperformed your stock by 150% in the last ten years. It's bad enough that your expertly managed company, but to lose out to a hunk of metal that sits around collecting dust? haha
They still have a pension. They're just not liable for investment losses in central States. They have a 7 billion dollar shortfall in their other pension.
The average UPS investor isn't an investor, he's an employee. Nobody with an ounce of investment sense would own UPS. What would be the investment purpose. It tracks the dow with a 95% overlay and has the same dividend.
You have to be completely and utterly brainless to take on pension risk, default risk, no barriers to entry risk and labor union risk for the same ROR and dividend you can get from an index fund.
The people who own UPS are financial ignoramuses. Not to be rude, but they are. Most can't a balance sheet from a sheet of #$%$ paper.
UPS hasn't really done anything in the last three years. This is after borrowing 4.5 billion for stock buybacks. Once the market starts to trend down in May, it'll go to $50. There is no marginal UPS buyer other than UPS. BTW, earnings don't mean anything. Look at thewir sales #
Money is flooding out of Hedge funds, even though they're not losing money. Public pensions are starting to fail. One huge pension in England just reduced benefits and raised contributions even though it';s funding levels are FAR FAR higher than UPS. (20% underfunded versus UPS's 35%)
As Rome burns these half wit self absorbed cash grabbing CEO's continue to pay themselves by the boatload. INvestors are going to get massacred.
Every day it's a better short. Every time they buy a share at a hyper inflated price they replace shareholders equity (money owed to you) with bank debt. (money owed bondholders) YOU THINK THIS IS GOOD!!! hahahahahaha... Honestly, you might be the most god awefull stupid investor on any board. By the way, my junior miners are up 75% in three months.
hahahah.. You have a plan? hahahahaha... Holding a stock given to you for free by your old employer is a plan? hahahahaha
My gold shares are going nuts, while UPS languishes. IN the meantime, I'm piling up cheap puts. By 2017, UPS will be $20
hahaha... I'm not smarter than UPS accountants. I'm just reading their numbers. But I have to ask, why are you a long term investor in a stock SENIOR MANAGEMENT is leaving faster than you'd leave a Barney Frank sleepover? hahahaha
Only Davis could hold his shares at no cost. He sold $11 million in a ZERO cost investment? What? He needs $11 million to put a new deck on his summer home? This has a $2 million tax bill attached to it. hahahaha
Davis sold 11 million in stock in March, stock he didn't own. He was a beneficial owner of an option grant. I sold stock I had to borrow. Criticize me all you want but I'm just taking investment advice from your former CEO.
Why doesn't Scott just hold, like you sucker board longs do? Because only a fool would hold a transport with a real PE close to 30, negative tangible book and a projected 15% drop in sales.
The thing holding UPS up is insider corporate buying with borrowed money. When this ends, the company is finished. This is a suicide strategy by short term managers looking to retire.
You own UPS and it blinds you. You seem to forget that UBER had to compete against taxi licenses. In places like NY and Boston, those licenses ran in the tens of thousands of dollars. To create an Uber system, all Amazon has to do is open warehouses. In a year where UPS doesn't make money on their pension, their post retirement benefit ALONE is $7 per hour per worker. That doesn't include the benefits paid to the WORKER HIMSELF. This is why I shorted GM in 2007.
The general rule on transports is that unless they're monopolies, like KSU they should trade at 8X trailing earnings and pay huge dividends