U.S. Markets open in 8 hrs 11 mins
  • S&P Futures

    +3.50 (+0.10%)
  • Dow Futures

    +3.00 (+0.01%)
  • Nasdaq Futures

    +39.50 (+0.33%)
  • Russell 2000 Futures

    +2.20 (+0.12%)
  • Crude Oil

    +0.24 (+0.53%)
  • Gold

    -3.80 (-0.21%)
  • Silver

    -0.14 (-0.60%)

    +0.0003 (+0.0238%)
  • 10-Yr Bond

    0.0000 (0.00%)
  • Vix

    -1.02 (-4.50%)

    -0.0014 (-0.1041%)

    +0.0260 (+0.0249%)

    -182.33 (-0.96%)
  • CMC Crypto 200

    +4.79 (+1.30%)
  • FTSE 100

    +98.33 (+1.55%)
  • Nikkei 225

    +129.55 (+0.50%)

Edited Transcript of 888.L earnings conference call or presentation 15-Apr-20 9:00am GMT

·51 min read

Full Year 2019 888 Holdings PLC Earnings Presentation Jun 9, 2020 (Thomson StreetEvents) -- Edited Transcript of 888 Holdings PLC earnings conference call or presentation Wednesday, April 15, 2020 at 9:00:00am GMT TEXT version of Transcript ================================================================================ Corporate Participants ================================================================================ * Aviad Kobrine 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director * Brian Roger Mattingley 888 Holdings plc - Non-Executive Chairman * Itai Pazner 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director ================================================================================ Conference Call Participants ================================================================================ * Bridie Anne Barrett Schmidt Stifel, Nicolaus & Company, Incorporated, Research Division - Analyst * David Brohan Goodbody Stockbrokers UC, Research Division - Analyst * Ivor Jones Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst * Richard Paul Stuber Numis Securities Limited, Research Division - Analyst * Simon James French Canaccord Genuity Corp., Research Division - Consultant Analyst * Simon John Davies Deutsche Bank AG, Research Division - Head of UK Midcap & Online Gaming Research * Ted Nyhan JP Morgan Chase & Co, Research Division - Analyst ================================================================================ Presentation -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Brian Roger Mattingley, 888 Holdings plc - Non-Executive Chairman [1] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Good morning, everybody. Thank you all for taking the time to join us today for 888's 2019 Full Year Results Presentation. I'm Brian Mattingley, Nonexecutive Chairman of 888. I am joined on the line today by the company's CEO, Itai Pazner; and by Aviad Kobrine, 888's CFO. We are sorry not to be able to present to you all in person this morning. But we look forward to seeing you all again soon. Before I hand over to Itai, who will kick off today's presentation, I just want to share a few brief thoughts on the company's progress in 2019 and briefly touch upon the current coronavirus situation, which I'm sure is at the front of everybody's mind. During 2019, the group delivered what I believe to be a very resilient set of financial results. We faced higher gaming duties in a number of jurisdiction as well as challenging conditions in some of our global markets. Despite this, we returned the business to double-digit top line growth on a like-for-like basis. In addition, during the year, we welcomed a record number of new customers, more than 1 million, to the 888's global brands. This is a significant achievement for the group and a very important indicator for our prospects. As announced in our trading update on the 24th of March 2020, the board is monitoring closely the spread of COVID-19, and our priority is the well-being of our global team and our loyal customers. While it remains unclear how this fast-moving situation will evolve over the coming weeks and months and it's incredibly difficult to predict how customers will react throughout this period of unprecedented uncertainty, as a purely online operator, we've diversified brand across product verticals and a strong balance sheet, the Board is confident in 888's ability to manage these challenges. I'm also pleased to report that the trading trends reported in our update on the 24th of March have continuated throughout today's date. With the spread of COVID-19 resulting in people spending increased time at home and perhaps experiencing heightened levels of stress and anxiety, the Board is in no doubt that 888's commitment to preventing gambling harm related -- harm is even more important than ever. We are proactively communicating with our customers to provide information on safer gaming, and where necessary, offer support. In addition, we have introduced new alerts to our unique safe gambling software system, the Observer, to ensure any areas of concern are immediately flagged to our highly trained customer care team. We know that this is a testing time for our colleagues and customers around the world. However, we have an outstanding team and an adaptable, resilient and vigilant culture. We have the infrastructure and mindset to continue to progress our plans despite having to adapt the way we work in the short term. On behalf of the Board, I would like to take this opportunity to thank our global teams for their amazing resilience during this challenging time. And on that, I would like to now pass you over to Itai. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [2] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Okay. Good morning, everyone, and thank you very much, Brian. So this is the first time we're reporting over our annual results over a conference call, and I can say this about many things that are happening in our organization these days that is work under a new -- in a new reality and adapting very fast in this reality. But conscious of our time today and the conference call format, we'll try to keep the presentation shorter than usual and, obviously, allow questions at the end. So I'll start with a quick operating update under COVID-19 on Slide #4. So the operation has been working under COVID-19 and how -- I wanted to share how we're dealing with this new reality. We've been preparing ourselves operationally in the last several weeks to move the organization into a remote working mode according to local guidelines, and in some countries, even ahead of local government's requirements as our employees' health and personal safety are at our top priority. We have now shifted to almost 100% of the organization, working through remote access or work from home mode. And as you can see in this photo, and I'm sure that you're all experienced -- you're experiencing these yourself these days, this is what a big time of our managers and employees' days, working days, are looking like. We're trying to continue our project delivery on plan with minimal delays. However, we realize that working capacity is not 100% efficiency. We're putting emphasis on our major projects and doing our best to deliver them without delays. I was naturally worried about moving all of our workforce to remote working in such a short period of time. But I have been pleasantly surprised by how smooth the transition was made and by the level of quality of the delivery in these times. I think this is due to the commitment and the spirit of the 888 employees, which is what we call the 8sters' spirit. And just like our employees, many of our customers are now at home, and their health and safety is also extremely important for us. As such, we are placing additional layers of monitoring, communications and actions around responsible gaming to make sure that they are playing within their means and not getting into additional and unnecessary financial stress during these times. Next slide, 5. Just to run quick through the highlights of 2019, which we'll obviously speak about in more detail in the presentation. So we had good progress on all of our strategic goals, which led to a double-digit growth on a constant currency basis. We feel that 2019 was a year of back-to-clear growth trend after a couple of years of reshaping our business under the new regulatory framework and requirements. Responsible gaming and compliance are key competitives of our business, and we believe that this is the way forward for a sustainable and responsible business growth model. We broke the $1 million FTD record in 2019, with a 22% FTD growth year-on-year, which is the fuel for future revenue growth coming into 2020. We continued our expansion into regulated Europe, successfully launching into Sweden and Portugal, and we are continuing to pursue our strategy of a well-diversified operator in terms of both markets and products that we work with. We continued our investment in product excellence, which underlines the growth of our casino and sports business. I'll now hand over to Aviad Kobrine, our CFO, to give a financial overview. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [3] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you very much, Itai, and good morning to all of you, wherever you are at. On Slide 7 and the financial highlights. We're pleased to report a record revenue of 10% at constant currency and 6% reported. This was led by 17% revenue increase in Casino and 19% in Sports, both at constant currency. Marketing ratio remained stable at 29%, but new customers increased 22%, to above 1 million for the first time, therefore, reflecting CPA reduced reflecting efficiencies. Our adjusted EBITDA before IFRS 16 was $86 million, it was impacted mostly by additional $26 million of gaming duties and $6 million of adverse FX movements. We have a strong balance sheet, with net cash at year-end of $27 million, and I can report that last Friday, the net cash position was $42 million. Despite these unprecedented times, given that we have not sought out government support in our strong balance sheet, the Board has declared a final dividend of $0.03 per share and $0.06 per share for the entire year, in line with our dividend payout policy. As we reported in our trading update on the 24th of March, we continue to trade profitably and generate cash with healthy current trading, a trend that continues to date. We do see significant decline in customer recruitment and revenue in our sports vertical, but the decline is offset in part by our other gaming verticals. Uncertainty remains high, and we must acknowledge potential risks ahead. The shortfall in first time depositors will have an increasing impact as the current situation persists, with slow recovery when we exit our current predicament. New advertising restrictions have been imposed in Sweden, in Spain and Portugal and other restrictions in Belgium and Sweden is continuing its steps. Consumer confidence and spending may deteriorate the longer time the current economic freeze continues. On Slide 8, group revenue. It shows a concise snapshot of our revenue by vertical. Casino, which represents 64% of revenue, continues its growth path followed by Sport, and I will cover Poker and Bingo in a few slides in a few minutes. Our B2B business went structural changes with the migration of Costa Bingo and AAPN from B2B into B2C and the migration of Cashcade, leaving it exposed to the weakness in the U.K. Bingo environment. B2B has started this year well and in line with our expectations. On Slide 9, group revenue. On this slide, we wanted to demonstrate that in 2019, we generated record revenue of $560 million or $580 million at constant currency. We have a resilient business, which delivered consistent revenue growth over many years, with CAGR of 15% since 2003. On Slide 10, on the left-hand side, you can see our revenue growth in 2019, and on the right-hand side, the same on a like-for-like basis. As you can see, our larger growth vertical Casino continued to perform well, both normally and on a like-for-like basis, with 26% increase in active and 31% increase in deposits. On Slide 11, you can see on the right-hand side, our strong customer acquisition trend. Sports, up 19%; Bingo, up 23%; Casino steadies up 43%. Customer recruitment in Poker was not far from the previous year, showing positive signs from the second half where Poker revenue was higher than the comparable period, with further positive trends showing clearly into 2020. Slide 12, our geographical segmentation. For this slide, I wanted to show that our geographic progress in regulated markets continue. And last year, a record 34% of group revenue was generated in regulated and tax markets. Importantly, revenue from regulated markets increased 22% at constant currency. Revenue from Italy, which now represents 9% of group, following a year of strong growth at 30% despite advertising restriction from the second half of last year. On the other hand, revenue from Germany declined sharply. It's represented 5.6% of revenue last year, ahead of regulatory changes, and there are quite a few heads. On Slide 13, Casino. Casino, which is our largest vertical, generated revenue of $359 million, or $371 million in constant currency. This was driven by all this platform, new content, AI-driven personalization engines and effective marketing execution, and Itai will elaborate further in a few minutes. This vertical tripled in size from 2009, delivering a CAGR of 12% per annum. Slide 14, Sport. Our Sport vertical continued its growth trajectory, with 19% revenue growth at constant currency to $90 million. Our Sport revenue increased tenfold since we changed platform in 2013 and delivered a staggering 46% CAGR. Slide 15, our Poker business. Revenue from our Poker products declined 13% last year on the backdrop of challenging industry trends. The withdrawal of pinned method in certain unregulated markets, and the fact that we do not offer shared liquidity between France and Spain. However, looking at the chart on the right, we can see the deposits from focus layers, including cross-sell into Casino and Sport, has stabilized from the second half of 2018, with these players generating 7% higher revenue in H2 2019 compared to the previous period, and we see similar trends in customer acquisition, and I can confirm that this trend continues well into this year. In addition, we also saw strong growth in Poker from the Italian market and encouraging results on the sharing liquidity between Spain and Portugal. On Slide 16, we show our Bingo business. Our Bingo revenue increased 19%, or 24% in constant currency, benefiting from the acquisition of Costa Bingo brands. Pro forma for the acquisition, revenue was down 3%. However, FTDs were up 23% in total and 10% up without the acquired brands, and the positive trends continues into 2020. On Slide 17, marketing. In 2019, our marketing investment increased to $162 million, with marketing ratio remains similar to previous year despite a 22% increase in new customer recruitment, reflecting lower CPA and higher efficiency. On Slide 18. On this slide, I wanted to show you the impact of our growth strategy in regulated markets, which resulted in $26 million of higher gaming duties than last year. Almost $11 million is attributed to the U.K. as a result of the change in tax rate from NGR to GGR in the U.K., and this was coupled with close to $5 million from gross revenue in the U.K. More than $6 million of additional gaming duties were generated in Italy due to an increase in tax rate and our growth in organic revenue now. The rest of the increase in gaming duties is related mainly to new regulated markets such as Sweden, Portugal and growth in Romania. Slide 19. On Slide 19, we show our adjusted EBITDA for the year at $86 million, which reflects $92 million of constant currency, with our margin at 15.3%. As I showed in the previous slide, adjusted EBITDA was adversely impacted by mainly $26 million of higher gaming duties and $6 million of adverse FX. Remember, this figure is before the flattering impact of IFRS 16 at $6.5 million. I wanted to show you a like-for-like comparison to last year. Reported EBITDA was actually $92 million, and you can refer to the details in the P&L balance sheet and cash flow, which are all in the appendix to this presentation. Slide 20. I wanted to round off this section of the presentation by sharing with you a bridge between our adjusted EBITDA reported last year and the $86 million reported this year before IFRS 16. During the year, we generated healthy organic growth of $11 million. This is represented by the green book in the chart. At the same time, we took a hedge of $10 million from external changes to gaming duties and $7 million of gaming duties and penetration costs in new regulated markets, Sweden and Portugal. And the rest of the delta is explained mainly by consolidation of our U.S. AAPN joint venture, which include U.S. B2C losses, the new Sport platform operation and the migration of Cashcade Bingo. More detail, as I mentioned, is available in the appendices to this presentation. And I will now hand over back to Itai for his operational review. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [4] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Okay. Thank you, Aviad. So I'll start with the deposit trend. And from our perspective, this is a key indicator to the overall health of the business. We can see that after 2017 and 2018 flattish trend, which represents the shift to working under a more restrictive compliance regimes in many markets and specifically in the U.K., we are now back to a clear and consistent growth trend, which is even accelerating since the end of 2019 and going into 2020. Next slide, 23. Diversification of regulated markets is key for growth but also key for a mitigation of regulatory headwinds and other headwinds like we are seeing in these days. By quantum, the U.K. is by far our biggest casino FTD driver, but we see some emerging regulated markets that are fast growing: Romania and Sweden, which are significantly higher post regulation; Portugal as a new market as well; and also the U.S., where we see growth in FTD's trend since we launched Orbit in New Jersey. Next slide, 24. Effective marketing. So in 2019, we surpassed the 1 million FTDs threshold, with a marketing budget of just over $160 million, which represents a 22% year-on-year growth in FTDs, with a very effective average CPA of $160. This demonstrates a clear trend of growth, alongside cost efficiency, which is a result of a few factors. First of all, product improvements, Orbit Casino, the front end of our sports product, the Kambi product, we changed the front end and further product enhancements that I will elaborate on a bit in a few minutes; and improved customer product journey and customer funnels in regulated markets, supported by our proprietary back end systems, which improves conversion rates; and change in our marketing mix and channels; and aligning the creative with the fast shifting trends of consumption of content into digital media channels, such as social networks, YouTube and other mobile apps, we made a big shift of marketing into these areas; and much less reliance on the traditional or above-the-line channels such as TV sponsorships, which are becoming more and more challenged in different regulatory markets. And next, I'm going to speak about safe gaming in Slide 25. So safe gaming is a top organization goal and priority for us. We have invested a huge amount of resource in developing more accurate and sophisticated safer gaming tools. And the core of this effort is our proprietary alerting and notification platform, which is called the Observer, which has been developed by our data science team and supported by internal and external responsible gaming experts. We are alerting and limiting more customers who we feel can be at risk, and as a result of our efforts in this area, we see a much wider use of our responsible gaming tools. We also launched a TV and social media campaign under the title: Too Much Is Too Much, demonstrating to consumers that as much gaming can be fun and part of their leisure activity, but it could also be harmful if it's not done in a responsible and measured manner. We have extensive training programs for management and employees of all levels and discipline. And finally, this is not a one-off initiative for the company, I see myself personally responsible for -- responsible gaming becoming part of the 888's -- or 8sters' DNA, and we will continue investing in this area just as we are investing in enhancing our core products. Moving on to the next slide, U.K. success. So the U.K. trend marks a turnaround in our business and our focus on recreational customer experiences. We have a much lower reliance on VIPs now, as you can see on the slide here, below 5% of revenues coming from VIPs. We believe the U.K. demonstrates one of the most advanced markets in online gaming in terms of the responsible gaming requirements. And for us, it represents a case study for our ability to work and grow under these types of conditions. All of our products are showing encouraging trends, with Casino and Sports leading with a strong momentum in 2019, which is continuing into Q1 in 2020. Next, Slide 27, regulated markets in Continental Europe. In this ever-changing industry, we believe that market diversification is key. We launched into 2 new markets in 2019, which are Sweden and Portugal, which we are seeing significant growth trends since we launched into the markets. And we currently operate in 6 regulated markets in Continental Europe, EU, apart from the U.K., Spain, Italy, Romania, Portugal, Sweden and Denmark. The next regulations in Continental Europe are Germany, which was expected to launch sports betting quite soon. This process has been slightly delayed, but we're in the process with [HEF], receiving a license from the HEF District, and the new markets that we are expecting to launch in the future in Europe, or Netherlands, which is a big potential market that expected -- is expected to regulate in mid-2021, and we are confident that there are many growth opportunities in Continental Europe. But moving on to the next region, which is the U.S. on Slide 28. This is by far the biggest potential for the company and the industry. So allow me to dwell a bit for a couple of minutes on this slide. We had our hands full in turning around our core markets and upgrading all of our products in the last 2 years. And in the last 6 to 12 months, we've been refocusing and shifting more and more attention and resources into the U.S. market with what we call a dual-headed strategic approach. The first part of that strategic approach is our organic approach, and we're working on bringing the best and latest products of 888 into the American market that have a different technological setup than the rest of the world, and therefore, we need to make some adjustments and upgrades through our existing products there. We believe that, eventually, gaming will represent 50% of the U.S. market potential. When I say gaming, I mean, obviously, Poker and specifically, Casino. And as such, Casino and Poker markets are a priority for us. With the WSOP partnership that we have in place in our strong gaming heritage, we believe that we can take a meaningful share of this potential market in the future. Sports is already becoming big in the U.S. and has the fastest growth potential in the market and the fact that we now own our own proprietary sports platform will allow us to leverage this asset in the U.S. As part of our organic growth plan, we're working on launching 3 to 4 additional markets by the end of 2021, and this is all over our new technical -- our latest technical infrastructure and product that we're planning to bring into the market. On the non-organic front in the U.S., and we're looking at market partnerships with either local land-based casino, big significant groups that operate there and brands or with big and significant media companies. And unlike in other countries where we operate in Europe or other places in the world, we operate quite independently. We believe that in the U.S., a partnership can enhance our market position and market share going forward. We're coming into this market with what we believe is a unique set of assets and the long-standing expertise in running a large-scale growing online gaming business. I believe that this can be very beneficial for a serious and large local partner that has strong ambitions to expand into this emerging online U.S. gaming market. Moving on to the next slide, Slide 29, a bit about our product centricity or product division. So product ownership and control is probably the biggest benefit of owning your proprietary platform. It creates a competitive advantage, but only when you can leverage this and create superior and differentiated product. The fact that we have been independent and not too busy on large-scale corporate transactions and integrations in the last few years, allowed us to focus our efforts and our consumer experiences and what we call product excellence. The investment in both the front end products like Orbit Casino or our new Poker product that recently launched or the new Poker 8 product that's coming in this summer, and the front end products that we've developed, accompanied with our back-end systems and tools, such as bonus optimization, advanced responsible gaming tools, payment methods and expediting cash-outs for customers are all things that we can do when we own our proprietary software. All of these are part of what we believe will create a differentiated and superior customer experience. Next slide, 30, the road towards personalization. We placed personalization and AI at the center of our product division, with over 700 games today in our casino, 100% of them are now covered by a different recommendation engines in different consumer segments. We have more than 16 AI models in place, working concurrently over our Orbit product at the moment, and 40% of our players are clicking and engaging by our different recommendations that are presented in an intuitive and relevant placements over our Orbit Casino. Applying both in-house proprietary models and testing against third-party algorithms and models, we can see that personalization is creating considerable uplift, better stickiness to our products, more games played per player and an easy, comfortable customer experience. We're now developing and implementing similar AI models. And the mindset across all of our products, if it's Poker 8, that's going to be launched soon, spectate our new sports product and our responsible gaming tools are also being designed in the same way. Next slide, 31, Casino leadership. So we set a strategic target to become the world's leading online casino. Since the launch of Orbit product, we have seen unprecedented growth in the different territories that Orbit was rolled out to. The Orbit platform is the foundation for future developments and enhancements in the world of online casino. And in line with its growth, we're continuing to invest more and more into product innovation and enrichment of our casino content. Next slide. The new 888 sports platform. So our second strategic intention is to become a top-tier sports book. Sports is currently suffering, as you all know, from the COVID-19 epidemic, more than any other vertical in our business and arguably, more than many industries in the world. But I believe it will be one of the first to recover because sports is in the core and part of the culture of every country in the world, and they will find ways to bring it back fast. But in order to become a top-tier player, we believe that we need to own our own product and trading back-end platform. Owning our platform allows us to launch products like we launched recently, Up For 8, which is a prediction game, which has seen tremendous traction since its launch. And I'm happy and proud to share with you that just 1 year after we acquired the BetBright platform, and exactly on plan, even with some disruption from COVID-19, we launched Spectate, which is the new brand, our new name for our proprietary sports betting product in Sweden on the 1st of April. Unfortunately, there aren't too many sporting events going on at the moment to fully stress test this product, but we are seeing good comparative indicator and cut in positive customer feedback on the new products. The next market that we're planning to launch towards the end of this year is U.K., which is our biggest sports market plus several other markets, which are planned to launch this year. Moving on to Bingo. Bingo platform, which supports some of the leading U.K. brands, both B2C brands and B2B brands, has stabilized after a couple of troubled years with regulatory developments in the U.K. We're also encouraged by the initial results of the new front-end product that we launched in Bingo in late 2019, which is already now available to 70% of the brands. And by the end of Q2 this year, just in a couple of months, all the brands and all the players will have full access to this enhanced product and enhanced front end. We've also relaunched our 888ladies brand campaign earlier this year, and we're seeing very positive results on 888ladies since that launch. Moving on to Poker. So Poker is a vertical that we are long and strong believers in this vertical. And as such, we have a very big product overhaul coming out this summer, which is called Poker 8. We can see that during COVID-19, Poker has been one of the strongest performers, and poker enthusiasts are returning to play poker. They can enjoy a range of poker games, from free roll tournaments and very low buy-ins to poker tournaments, where they can participate from for free or for very low sums of money and play and entertain themselves for a relatively long period of time to products like Blast Poker, which is a faster and more exciting poker game that we launched over a year ago. And the return to Poker is a clear sign that the product is still very much relevant and that via continuous product investment and innovation, it can return to growth. We believe, particularly, that in the U.S., where poker is a household game, it has a big potential and specifically, with our product -- with our Poker 8 products that's going to be launched soon, and our partnership with the WSOP, which can lead us to a pull position in the U.S. market. Slide 35, and the last slide. So just a summary of what we went through today and what we see as the current status of our business. So 2009 (sic) [2019] was turning back to growth. Modest upper ender for us after a couple of years of regulatory headwinds and required business adjustments that we put into place. The 1 million FTDs we brought last year are an increase of 22% of FTDs are paying off in terms of revenue growth since Q4 and going into Q1 this year. At the moment, we're fortunate not to be too heavy reliant on sports or retail, and sports represented 17% of our revenue last year and less than 20% of our revenue this year. And our well-diversified strategy of markets and products is paying off with our gaming products, partially compensating for the temporary decline in Sports. All of our verticals are on track with new products, which are live or coming very soon. With the new Spectate 888 sports platform live and performing well since April 1 in Sweden. Casino and Sports are leading our growth, while Poker and Bingo, that slightly suffered in the last year, are now stable and even showing initial growth signs. We have a strong organic growth agenda in various markets, supported by our in-house technological platform. U.K. is to deliver double-digit growth under new and enhanced responsible gaming procedures is significant success for our company. And we see the U.S. as a massive growth potential, and we're moving more and more focused forces into that direction without neglecting our core business and growth opportunities in Europe and in other territories. In addition, we see that there are several strategic options for us and specifically, these days, such as M&A opportunities, U.S. partnerships and acquisitions of smaller companies that are potential for us. We feel that the business is healthy and resilient, with a strong balance sheet and cash position, which is extremely important always, but specifically in these days. And finally and more personally, these days, I would like to wish you all health and ask you personally to keep safe as we are still ahead -- as we're still not at the end of this health crisis. And now we'll be happy to take some questions from people on the line. I'm handing back over to the moderator. ================================================================================ Questions and Answers -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Operator [1] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (Operator Instructions) The first comes from Ted Nyhan from JPMorgan. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ted Nyhan, JP Morgan Chase & Co, Research Division - Analyst [2] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Just a couple of questions from me. What is the -- your current outlook for the German casino business in the context of the new interstate treaty and some of the restrictions that are in that? And in terms of M&A, do you think that activity is likely during the COVID period? Or is this something for more the medium term and finally, I suppose, is there -- what's your outlook for gaming duties in FY '20, so from either new markets or tax increases? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [3] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So Aviad, do you want to answer -- would you like to answer those questions? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [4] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I will give it my best, Itai. As we know, Germany was supposed to regulate sports betting on an interim basis until July '21. When the new regime comes into place, as we all know, last week, an Austrian company filed a challenge to the sports betting licensing process and the various arguments, including lack of transparency. A court basically granted suspension of that regime, and these sport licenses are not going to be issued immediately. We are aware that the authorities are going to appeal, and that appeal process can take anywhere from 2 to 6 or 7, 8 months. So we don't really know what's going to happen to the sport regime. Remember, this is an interim regime. And potentially, this could have implications on the casino regime under the new treaty from July '21. So I know it's not exactly the answer that you wanted, but there is uncertainty there. I think more delays are more likely than not than a week ago, and we're just going to have to follow very closely the development there. I think it was also widely held that even if the sports interim regime were to continue, there was a widely held belief that the casino regime under the new treaty would also be challenged on all sorts of ground. So the answer is we don't really know. Current status quo continues. The last question was about changing gaming duties in 2020. At the moment, I'm not aware of changing gaming duties. I think the next one, which is known to us is actually in 2021. When the Netherlands regulate towards the second half of next year, they will impose a 29% GGR tax. And that is as much as I know at the moment. And I think I probably missed your second question, Ted. So apologies, would you be able to repeat? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [5] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes. I'll answer the third one... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ted Nyhan, JP Morgan Chase & Co, Research Division - Analyst [6] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes. M&A, it's... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [7] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes, M&A. I'll take that question, Ted. So yes. So I think M&A activity obviously takes time. Nothing can happen there immediately, but I do think the current situation and companies that are in a less fortunate position than ours, and even companies that are in good position, I think this will initiate some new M&A opportunities and processes in the near future, so I think the processes will start quite early on. But again, the processes usually take a bit time, so I don't think they'll end in the near future. But I definitely feel that there are going to be some opportunities that crop up in the next few weeks or very early months. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Operator [8] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Next question on the line is from Simon Davies from Deutsche Bank. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Simon John Davies, Deutsche Bank AG, Research Division - Head of UK Midcap & Online Gaming Research [9] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A few from me, please. Firstly, you've seen a remarkable shift towards a recreational player base in the U.K. Can you flesh out your comments a bit on that in terms of what is your definition of a VIP, given that revenues are now less than 5% coming from VIPs? What has happened to average lifetime value for customer over the last 18 months? And can you give an indication of what you think average stake is a slot spin at the moment? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [10] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad, would you like to take that question? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [11] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- With pleasure. Simon, what we see is -- we definitely saw last year a reduction in lifetime value. That is -- goes hand-in-hand with the fact that only 4% of Casino revenue in the U.K. was generated by VIPs. It was accompanied by a very significant increase in FTDs. So the ratio, if you like, of lifetime value to CPA remain constant. That is the, really, real profitability at the atomic level. So CPA went down, lifetime as well went down, and we're very happy with that trend. I can also report that what we have seen over the past several weeks is that we have seen actually even more recreational players coming back to Poker, which was kind of a less loved product in the last several years. And into Casino, where our much lower CPAs, much lower lifetime value, and that is the major difference that we see in the last few weeks in that respect. We don't disclose exactly the threshold, Simon, of what is the VIP and the reason is that there is no exact definition across the industry. But they are clearly the higher payer values, but we're not talking about huge obscene amounts. We're just talking people that are not just recreational and spending a few hundred pounds, it's more than that, but it's not a huge amount. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Simon John Davies, Deutsche Bank AG, Research Division - Head of UK Midcap & Online Gaming Research [12] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And what about average spend take? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [13] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I don't particularly see a change. I would probably -- I know at least for the Poker, that there is more widespread use of the lower tables, which are clearly the recreational tables, the recreational value on a Poker tournament where you can play for hours on just putting a few dollars in. It's very prevalent or even a free roll so we can clearly see that in the poker. Potentially, because of the recreational players and slots in the U.K., probably lower. But it was lower even before, so it's not a huge difference. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Simon John Davies, Deutsche Bank AG, Research Division - Head of UK Midcap & Online Gaming Research [14] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Less than GBP 2, on average? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [15] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Clearly, there's a big chunk, which is less than GBP 2. Yes. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Simon John Davies, Deutsche Bank AG, Research Division - Head of UK Midcap & Online Gaming Research [16] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And secondly, just on regulated revenue streams, obviously, it's at 74% in 2019. What do you think the run rate is now in Q1 2020? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [17] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai, I'll answer that. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [18] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes. Please go ahead. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [19] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sure. We certainly see significant growth across our regulated markets this year, even before the eventualities of the COVID, we certainly see growth in Italy, Romania, places like Sweden and a bit in the U.K. as well. And we certainly see that trend continues, and I suspect if it will continue at this rate, this year, we will report a higher proportion than the 74% of last year. In unregulated markets, predominantly Germany, went down significantly last year. We did not put focus in that market because of the regulatory changes. There was also an impact of payment methods. It's basically the correct trajectory, more regulated and less unregulated. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Operator [20] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The next question is from David Brohan from Goodbody. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- David Brohan, Goodbody Stockbrokers UC, Research Division - Analyst [21] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Just 2 questions for me. One just on the Poker, the European liquidity network. What countries are in this? And are there plans to add more over kind of 2020 and 2021? And then just on the U.S. What are the key objectives for the U.S. business in 2020? And are you seeing strong uplifts in Casino and Poker currently where the Sports is off the table? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [22] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes. I'll answer those questions. So at the moment in the shared liquidity network in Europe for us is Spain and Portugal, where we had -- Spain was almost a duopoly for a few years until some competitors joined through shared liquidity network, specifically from France. So today, Poker -- in the European Poker liquidity network is a bit more competitive or the Spanish market is a bit more competitive. Currently, we have, like I said, Portugal, Italy, said or announced that they will join the shared liquidity network, but it hasn't happened yet. We're still hopeful that this will happen in the future because we have Poker in Italy, so connecting that to the existing game network can only be beneficial for us, and we believe for the network, overall, for the shared liquidity network. And the next market that we're not in at the moment is France, which we are considering to enter at some point of time, but we don't have a specific time line for that yet. So that's Poker. And in U.S. and actually, elsewhere, we are seeing a growth in both Casino and Poker in recent weeks after sports betting became -- basically it's not unavailable, but it's very, very limited, and the U.S. is representing similar trends. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Operator [23] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The next question is from Ivor Jones from Peel Hunt. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [24] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Perhaps I'll just ask questions one at a time, so I don't forget the answers. You've talked about revenue year-to-date. Could you just talk about from costs? Is the market that you would have spent in sports being retargeted to the other products? Or is marketing spend down? And I think you've touched on this, but if I guess Casino is now a more competitive space, so is it getting more difficult to get a return on those CPAs? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [25] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes. So the marketing spend for sports definitely decreased. And like I said before, a lot of our marketing is based on online and performance in marketing that is also related to the amount of demand that's coming our way. So if there are more people searching for online poker or online casino on Google, and we are paying on a pay-per-click basis, then our marketing costs are increasing overall, but on an average, we are seeing a reduction. But overall, I would say that these times, there's going to be more marketing because of higher demand in Casino and Poker, which are our biggest verticals and Bingo. And sports is obviously offsetting that, some of the savings that we're making in sports. But overall, marketing will probably grow these days. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [26] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And retaining its efficiency? Or should we worry about competition -- increased competition for Casino? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [27] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We don't see a problem in competition. We always have competition in Casino, and not much have changed. If you're referring to competitors that were active in Sports shifting budgets to Casino, it's always been a very competitive space, online casino. We are performing effectively there. I think the bigger question is lifetime values. If they maintain as they were in the past because of potential, things like recession that are coming and less ability of customers to spend. At the moment, we aren't seeing a significant decline in values. We are seeing an increase in marketing dollars through CPAs, but the average CPAs are not going up, even slightly going down. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [28] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Can I ask you about what happens when sports comes back? I guess that there's going to be very competitive marketing from the sports-led brand. Will -- should we just assume 888 will lose market -- some of its market share that it's gained because it will be too expensive to recover customers, and it will be a slower recovery than the obvious leading sports brands? What's the plan for the return of sports? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [29] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I think we've been quite consistent in growing sports over the last few years. And because we're growing, it's now a vertical that's worth over $100 million. And for us, it's becoming a very significant vertical for us, but I think our base is always lower than the other, so we have more room for growth at the moment. I assume that the big and more reliant sports operator will come back quite strong when they come back in terms of marketing, but I don't think we're going to lose share. We'll at least maintain share, if not, the growth with the launch of the new products because products and product experiences also have to do with growth in the verticals. And as I mentioned before, we're launching our new product. We're planning to launch additional features. Overall, our ambition is to have a better experience and a better product, so we're not projecting a decline in sports when it comes back. If anything, customers who have not been active for a long time, I think they will be more active when it comes back. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [30] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And could we talk about Slide 22 that shows business momentum and deposit trends? I just want to check on some -- what I'm looking at. Is that deposits in monetary and dollar value against the base level? It's not number of players, is it? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [31] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No, that's actual deposits in dollars. Correct, Aviad? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [32] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Correct. Yes. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [33] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And up to what time period is it showing? I can't quite tell from this exactly. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [34] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- It's right at the end of Q1. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [35] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is including February. Yes. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [36] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So I think one of you said February, and one of you said Q1? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [37] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No. Sorry, sorry, yes. Whenever you ask about numbers, Aviad is always right. So if we both answered, he's always right. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [38] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sorry, and Aviad, what was the answer? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [39] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In this case, actually, Itai was right. It is the end of Q1. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [40] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So pretty recently, and a pretty unusual spike for that period. What does your trading statement today tell us then that, that trajectory carried on to April? There was further growth year-over-year in the first part of April? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [41] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Our trading statement from the 24th of March stated that we increased in revenue. Average daily revenue was 18% increase in Q1 '19, and we said today that this trend continues. So we see the same trends as we saw then, and that was it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [42] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Okay. Not necessarily an acceleration that, that chart might imply. Okay. And lastly, you said that B2B had started well. And I just want to make sure I understood what that meant. B2B year-over-year is lost Cashcade? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [43] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Correct. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [44] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Right? You got that the right way around? So you're talking about B2B growing Q1 on Q4 last year? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [45] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes. The existing -- the remaining B2B, excluding Cashcade, obviously. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ivor Jones, Peel Hunt LLP, Research Division - Analyst [46] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So on a year-over-year basis, it's been growing on a like-for-like product. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Operator [47] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The next question from the line is from Simon French of Canaccord. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Simon James French, Canaccord Genuity Corp., Research Division - Consultant Analyst [48] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Three for me, please. Firstly, just on the sports book, could you outline what the next markets will be for the rollout of the proprietary sports book once you've bedded down Sweden? And then secondly, on the balance sheet, did I hear you say, Aviad, that you had $42 million of net cash as of last week? And when does the RCFs with Barclays mature, please? And then thirdly, on Bingo, in the last slide, in the appendices, there's some charts relating to 888ladies and Costa. Specifically looking at Costa, what have been the lessons you've learned from that experience of buying in that customer from the B2B customer base? And does that give you confidence to look to pick up other, perhaps, struggling businesses in that segment over the next few months? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [49] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So I'll take the Sports and Bingo, and I'll let Aviad take the net cash and RCF. So starting with sports, I mentioned this, the next market that we're planning to launch is the U.K., which is the biggie, that's a significant part of our sports and probably the most competitive sports market, sports betting market globally. So as you can see, there's quite a big period between Sweden and the U.K. So first of all, we're launching Sweden as kind of the first, what we call test market. We'll see that everything there is working well, that it's stable, that customers are happy with the product. We have a few more U.K. style features and actually innovations that we're developing towards the launch in the U.K., which is supposed to happen, I would say, towards the end of Q4 this year. And alongside with the U.K., we will be launching some more of our dot com markets or yet to be regulated markets. I don't have the exact list at the moment, but there will be some more markets launched before the end of this year. So that's -- yes, one second, I'm just about the Bingo. So ladies, I'm just trying to get to that slide. But ladies, what we did, we relaunched -- we basically relaunched the brand. It's not a new platform, it's just like a brand uplift, I would call it, a refreshment. We haven't invested a lot in ladies for a few years now. And we saw very good response, specifically in terms of the FTDs since the launch of Bingo, I think the slide that you're referring to is the FTDs. Yes, new customers trend since the launch of ladies. So it's quite stable in the last couple of years, and I think it's a very good and strong response for a relaunch of a brand, and it shows, I think, the strong affinity to 888 overall as a group and specifically to 888ladies, which is a brand that has a lot of heritage. It's the first brand that we launched in the U.K. after we acquired the Globalcom platform. It has very many loyal players and now, a lot of new players that joined through kind of the uplift of the brand that we recently did. And Costa, you can also see the trend of new players in 2020. So like I said before, Costa was a brand that didn't enjoy a lot of investment in the last couple of years of its life with its previous owner. We saw that as an opportunity to, again, take this over, slightly uplift the brand, reinvest in it because, again, it's one of the kind of household Bingo brands in the U.K. and it's working over our platform. So there's a lot of synergy in this acquisition, and we are making learnings. And if more of these opportunities will come our way, I think we will definitely consider them positively, depending, obviously, on the terms that they come in. But I think it definitely wasn't a bad experience. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Simon James French, Canaccord Genuity Corp., Research Division - Consultant Analyst [50] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Okay. And historically, Costa was very reliant on bonusing, I seem to remember. Have you managed to move the brand away from that? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [51] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes, absolutely. And that's one of the challenges that we had. We had to adjust it to kind of our way of operating brands, and players were used to previous kind of brand management, including a lot of bonusing. We -- in general, we reduced level of bonusing in general, and in these days, specifically, and that's part of the process that we did in Costa Bingo. And I think, over time, we'll see the effect of that in more positive contribution. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [52] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'll take the other 2 questions, Simon. So our revolving credit facility with Barclays was down to 3-year period. It's about 1 year old now, so there's 2 more years to run. And in terms of our liquidity for last Friday, which was Good Friday, it was a very good day, indeed, our net cash -- net corporate cash was $42 million last Friday. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Operator [53] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The next question is from Richard Stuber from Numis. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Richard Paul Stuber, Numis Securities Limited, Research Division - Analyst [54] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Two for me, please. I was wondering, in terms of your U.S. strategy, quick for growth, it sounds like you're investing more in the U.S. this year. I guess -- basically, could you give me some sort of guidance in terms of what sort of losses you expect from the U.S.? And presumably, this is just on this, the organic strategy? You wouldn't be able to comment if it's any other way? That's my first question. And the second question is in terms of investment in safer gaming initiatives, you've obviously been spending quite a lot last year. Any sort of guidance in terms of how much that is in dollar terms? And do you expect to further increase investments in safer gambling for this year, too? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [55] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes. So I'll start with the U.S. So we've actually announced that we're looking to lose up to high single-digit millions of dollars in the U.S. this year, about $8 million. And that's through our organic strategy, which requires more marketing to build our brand, to acquire new customers. I think that's quite a natural trend going into a new market. Obviously, America has a lot of submarkets and opportunities in it. And I think the investment, the organic investment will be required for us and for other operators over the next few years. It's not a one-off. So that's the U.S. and safer gaming initiative, so we don't mention how much we spend per product, just like we don't announce how much we spend on Poker 8 or on Orbit or our on our new sports betting platform. But it is a considerable amount of our resources that are being deployed to creating responsible gaming tools, but not only to creating the tools and the alert systems, but also to making them more approachable and intuitive and easy-to-use for our customers. So the projects that we're going to be launching, the bigger projects that we're going to be launching this year is our stake zone, which is basically a front-end product for all the game -- all the responsible gaming tools and options that our customers have, where we are directing our customers through the campaign, through our alerting system, and that will be the main investment in this year's product delivery around responsible gaming. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Richard Paul Stuber, Numis Securities Limited, Research Division - Analyst [56] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I see. And are these tools offered to customers across all your geographies? Or these are mainly the U.K. base of gambling tools? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [57] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- They're offered across all geographies, but each market has specific -- some markets have specific requirements that we deploy in those markets. So the safer zone in the U.K. will not look identical as in Spain or in Italy or in other markets. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Operator [58] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The next question is from Bridie Barrett from Stifel. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bridie Anne Barrett Schmidt, Stifel, Nicolaus & Company, Incorporated, Research Division - Analyst [59] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In fact, you answered pretty much all of my questions. But if I could just clarify your last point on the U.S. business, did you say that the net loss was $8 million last year, you expect the same again this year despite of the fact that you're expecting to launch in full state and probably again in 2021, did I get that right? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [60] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Not exactly. I'll make myself clearer. Last year, we lost less than $8 million. We lost -- Aviad, did we -- did we announce... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [61] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We didn't, but we have no secrets. We lost on the U.S. B2C almost $3 million in '19. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [62] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And the expectation for this year is around $8 million. Again, depending on the level of the marketing investments. So now obviously, we're going to spend less because sports is not happening. So we're not going to spend on Sport. But this is for the existing markets in the U.K., the plan to launch additional markets, B2C markets because we also launched B2B markets through our partnership with Caesars. But on the B2C side, the plan to go into more markets is probably only going to happen early next year. So that $8 million that I mentioned is for B2C activity this year in New Jersey -- in America, sorry. And next year, when we go into further markets, New Jersey, hopefully, will pick up in terms of revenue, but we will need to continue investing in further markets. So the U.S. is a long-term investment cycle as more and more markets open and require launching, penetrating, building brands, et cetera. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bridie Anne Barrett Schmidt, Stifel, Nicolaus & Company, Incorporated, Research Division - Analyst [63] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Okay. That's clear. And just as you mentioned, Caesars, as it stands today, does that relationship feel secure following the Eldorado deal? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [64] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yes. We haven't heard anything that gives us a sense of insecurity. If anything, the other way around, we're looking to launch into Pennsylvania, WSOP Poker. I can share that like Poker everywhere else in the world in the markets that are regulated and available currently in the U.S. They're also benefiting from the situation and more, and more people are returning to poker. So at the moment, I don't see any change in that relationship. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Operator [65] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These are the questions we have time for today, so I'll now hand back to the management team for any final remarks. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Itai Pazner, 888 Holdings plc - CEO & Director [66] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Okay. Just wanted to thank everyone for the time and the patience over the conference call, and wish you all health, and hope you stay safe. Thank you very much. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aviad Kobrine, 888 Holdings plc - CFO & Director [67] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you.