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Edited Transcript of TFI.PA earnings conference call or presentation 14-Feb-20 10:00am GMT

Full Year 2019 Television Francaise 1 SA Earnings Call

Boulogne Cedex Feb 21, 2020 (Thomson StreetEvents) -- Edited Transcript of Television Francaise 1 SA earnings conference call or presentation Friday, February 14, 2020 at 10:00:00am GMT

TEXT version of Transcript


Corporate Participants


* Gilles Christian Gérard Pélisson

Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Chairman & CEO

* Philippe Denery

Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Executive VP of Finance & Procurement

* Stéphanie Laval

Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Head of Financial Communication and IR


Conference Call Participants


* Annick Tonie Maas

Exane BNP Paribas, Research Division - Analyst

* Christopher Johnen

HSBC, Research Division - Analyst

* Conor O'Shea

Kepler Cheuvreux, Research Division - Head of Media Sector

* Jérôme Bodin

ODDO BHF Corporate & Markets, Research Division - Analyst

* Julien Roch

Barclays Bank PLC, Research Division - MD & European Media Analyst




Stéphanie Laval, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Head of Financial Communication and IR [1]


[Interpreted] Good morning. I'm delighted to welcome you here this morning for the presentation of annual results for financial year 2019. There will be a Q&A session after the presentation. So first, we'll hear Gilles Pélisson and then Philippe Denery.


Gilles Christian Gérard Pélisson, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Chairman & CEO [2]


[Interpreted] Thank you, Stéphanie. So good morning all. Welcome to this presentation of our 2019 annual results. And before I go to the heart of the matter, I'd like to share with you a new video, which is a presentation of our raison d'être at TF1 presenting the company. So it's a challenge. It's also a promise. A promise which is in keeping with the history of our group, but also our high ambitions.



Gilles Christian Gérard Pélisson, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Chairman & CEO [3]


[Interpreted] So as you saw, that's quite ambitious, but I think we're definitely up for the challenge. So that is the transformation of the group, and that is our theme this morning.

We'll take us to what we call Total Video. Now in this presentation, you will see that we'll be coming back to the financials for 2019, the results and the strategic choices. This is true for multichannel, multiscreen, which has been a winner; then Newen, which is expanding internationally with success; and Unify, which was reorganized in 2019 and which is preparing an amazing growth. And then we have financial results, which are in line with our objectives. And Philippe and I set a 2-digit margin as an objective, and we have reached that and beyond. And then the dividends for shareholders, which will also be up. And then at the end of the presentation, we'll take a look at this year, a lot of opportunities in the Total Video world, especially regarding content and our offering, Newen, which will be continuing to roll out its business and partnerships, and then Unify, which we'll be looking up also this year.

Now the objective that we met, the multichannel strategy, a multiscreen strategy. We've been successful on both counts.

If you look at the slide, it's a very good surprise for the 2019. If you look at TF1, after 2018, the World Cup, the football World Cup, the French in the finals and winners at the end of the day. So that was definitely quite something. So after 2018, we expected a bit of a slowdown. So we have 32.6% market share, so for advertising targets, which is quite an exceptional performance for a European private television channel. And we are above 2017 and 1/3 above our first competitor, the M6 Group. And you see that there's improvement also for the 25- to 49-year-olds because a 29.4% market share is up against 2017 and also against 2018. The TF1, 22 points, that is more or less comparable to 2017, and we're talking about European channels that are losing ground. And yet, TF1 is holding its own. And that is quite unique in Europe. In Italy, you have the [La5], ITV in the U.K. And the figures there are some 15%. So our 20% is really something to be proud of.

So what is this based on? So this is what we wanted to do together with Ara Aprikian for contents, that is looking at our various channels and the French television landscape. So TF1, 22, so that is 15% more than the first challenger. Then TMC, which is #1 DTT channel in France, up 0.3 in 2019. TFX, 3.3 points of targeting millennials. And then TF1 Séries Films, 2.6. So that is strong as well.

The multichannel strategy is a winner. And it is based on 3 actions, which we combined. And that is a very wide range of strong content, and you will see that, that is something which really counts; then the news segments, which are part of the group's DNA and the lunchtime and evening news are still very strong; and then the complementarity with other channels within the group.

So this very wide range of strong content, I think, really gives our channels and our group an edge. There is a very high level of ambition which you won't find elsewhere. And we have results and successes which will carry us forward.

So for 2019, I think we got almost everything right when you have 100% on target for the TF1 channel and you have 98 of the 100 top audiences for 25- to 49-year-olds.

But what I want to draw your attention to is this. There is this solidity as we go forward. French drama didn't use to be what French content excelled in. But in wake of Hollywood, we've been able to make a lot of progress. Take Le Bazar de la Charité, up to 8.5 million viewers. And then entertainment, we have our franchises, The Voice, Danse avec les Stars, Koh-Lanta and others, which have been in our portfolio for a long time, but we have new things as well, Mask Singer, which Fox showed in the U.S. And that has been a success, up to 7.3 million viewers.

As to sports, it's still one of the beacons of our channel. We are within the top 3 audiences, and we're very proud at TF1 of the way we promote women's sports and showcasing of the Women's World Cup, which was a very great success, surprisingly so. And we also acquired the 2021 rights for the Euro Cup.

And then we have U.S. series. There are fewer. Their quality has lagged over the past 5 to 10 years, but we are able to attract the best. And we have successes like Manifest, The Good Doctor and quite a few others.

And so that is true for the various genres, but there is also the news, which is at the heart of our DNA. Our newscasts are at the top. Here, we're talking about bringing together all of the French audience. And this is daily news. You see 4.9 million, 5.3 million and 5.2 million viewers. But what you have to look at is how we perform vis-à-vis French public television, 2.4 million more than Jean-Pierre Pernaut and Anne Coudray is quite phenomenal. At lunchtime, on weekends, we are 2.7 million above France Télévisions and 1 million for the evening news. And of course, a source of great satisfaction for 2019 was the emergence and the confirmation of what had been done at LCE. And we meet -- met the audience target as soon as we moved to FTA. And the number is 26 but the audience figures are amazing, up 0.3 points, which is a source of pride.

Now there are the other channels which explain the results. They are made effective and complementary. So they are, first of all, exclusive content for targeted audiences. There's Quotidien on TMC with Yann Barthes. There seems to be some works going on, making a noise. And then Alain Chabat with Burger Quiz on TMC and TFX with series and reality TV programs.

And then we maximized content recycling. We discussed the multichannel policy, you may recall, and circulation of works is the key when you're negotiating rights with producers. And you have to see how a program can be broadcast on another channel. Le Bazar de la Charité is shown on TF1 Séries Films with 500,000 extra views.

So speaking of 2019, beyond the successes and the direction we are taking for the future regarding content. And in 2018, we were saying that we probably would have to be looking at Total Video, which focuses on targeting and personalization as that was something new for TF1, but I think that we made it a success in 2019. So it was a watershed, and we set up the MYTF1 app with a totally new and fresh personalized user experience. It started around June with new functions. Now you have all programs in their original version and with audio description for the hard of hearing. So we are up against the best, including Netflix. It's HD quality. It's 100% video. So it's a lot more immersive in terms of experience. And we also added to MYTF1, not just with the displaying of our usual programs, but we also looked to other contents which can also attract our viewers, mangas, telenovelas, first-run series, which means that we come to the following figures. MYTF1 was #1 catch-up service. And we were talking about 23 million, 24 million subscribers. The figure is now 27 million, and almost 7 million 16- to 24-year-olds who subscribe to MYTF1.

We have 1.8 billion video views. So that's up 24% year-on-year. And it's only part of the year, remember. So that is spectacular. And 30% extra viewers compared to our -- after first broadcast. So this strengthens the television media in terms of consumption.

Now internally, we feel that MYTF1 is, in a way, the sixth 100%-digital channel within the group. I'm talking about the app. We're up 70% consumption within the 1.8 billion views.

So if you combine the success of -- the audience success and combine it with something which is as powerful as the MYTF1 platform is becoming, it's a new way to monetize channels.

So we have some good news here. There is the S&P TV study, which was made available towards the end of the year. You're probably aware of it. With proven effectiveness of TV advertising, which was shown once again we have a higher return on investment. And it's especially the carryover effect, which attracts advertisers who had been lured towards digital. So in terms of carryover effect, we are on a par with major media. And 26 days carryover is the strength that the advertisers are attracted to in terms of resource. So -- and this is something which attracts pure players. For the TF1 group, we're talking plus 34% over 2 years in the money spent with us.

And it's also better monetization through data. We're talking about targeted advertising and television, but more than 30% of inventory is data-targeted. That is up 20% against 2018. And these targeted spots are worth a lot more because we manage to sell, on average, 35% more than ordinary inventory with Unify and the basis that have been created. So this is something which is up and running in order to commercialize content.

So in terms of revenue, and Philippe will come back to this, we stand at EUR 1.774 million (sic) [1.774 billion]. A slight dip in advertising revenue, but that is also due to the impact of the 2018 football World Cup, which brought in a lot. And then there were the 3 Rugby World Cup matches that were canceled in Japan because of the typhoon. And then there was social unrest in France in December. And this meant that some of the advertisers wanted to put a few things on hold. But we are doing better than our main competitors, so we're not going to complain this morning.

So we have some very strong sectors. That is retail, the car industry and then telecoms. MYTF1 has its success, I was mentioning before. So 8% up revenue -- on revenue growth. And then there's the carriage fees from operators. And that, of course, also worked in our favor. So this is all quite remarkable because we managed to attract these audiences, this success. We do this with a program cost which is totally under control for 2019, and the various actions we undertook, that is the multichannel strategy and the circulation of works, but also the policy we set up a few years ago, which was no longer output deals with the Americans, but cherry-picking, which allows us to go for what we really want. And that enhances the circulation of works as well.

So we have investments now which are adapted to seasonal trends. I often say this, we try to attract the best potential audience, but it's through better content. And we want better audiences, but we seek to align to the potential demand and advertisers' appetite. So we've been able to control costs, and that is with the combination of channels and Philippe's work monitoring performance constantly. So we can tell you today that we are even above the announced guidance. Because we talked at about EUR 990 million. We are at EUR 985 million in 2019, and we have very good inventory management because it stands at EUR 650 million, which is quite remarkable because that is done about 20% over 3 years. And you are aware that products become obsolete because of the wealth of content. And therefore, you have to be extremely careful in the way you manage inventory.

So that's what I wanted to share with you regarding all the television and broadcast actions. And maybe we can now talk about Newen and our production.

So as I was saying, by way of introduction, this year was hallmarked by a successful international expansion. And the De Mensen Company in Belgium is -- showed very high performance. And we acquired Reel One in Canada, and they produce 50 to 70 television films every year. So that is a genre which is slightly difficult -- different. It's slightly less ambitious than major films, but really very interesting because that is something all television channels want for their afternoon program. So it's a very useful niche.

Newen's revenue, which was very -- Franco-French Group in 2016 when we acquired it, has moved to something a lot more international as the international share being 32% in 2019. But for the future, the important thing is that it is a very good base for development when you -- and that's what you have to remember when you think of Newen. No, of course, traditionally, it was -- its big strength was fiction. And many actors and producers work for Canal+, France Télévisions, and I could refer to Candice Renoir, 5.2 million viewers on average. And then documentary and magazine with CAPA distributed in 87 countries. It is also the animation subsidiary with the Blue Spirit Studio with people working both in Angoulême in France and Montréal. It's a very small, high-performing studio with work up against Disney, Comcast and others, but with a lot of opportunity.

The new genre is TV movies with Reel One and entertainment. And recently, De Mensen did extremely well in the Netherlands and Belgium with Canvas. And then films with the film production at TELFRANCE.

Newen was announcing that a creator was coming from the U.K. to the new Ringside Studio. He made The Fall which we adapted at TF1 under the title Insoupçonnable. So the whole thing is growing. It's a way to build the future. And it's also a client base which is increasing and diversifying since the 2 main clients in France in 2016 have moved to first line in production and distribution. And of course, there's a whole range of clients here in France, both European and international, ARD, VTM, Discovery, HBO in the U.S. with Reel One, et cetera; and then the platforms which appeared in 2019, so Netflix, Amazon Prime, Disney and Hulu. So quite a few possibilities there, which we find very promising. And I'll be coming back to that when we start talking about the 2020 prospects and our outlook.

So let me now talk about Digital with Unify, which we totally transformed with Olivier Abecassis in 2019. So we're preparing for growth. This year was a year during which we structured the department and we consolidated the teams, and bringing them in from 7 sites in Paris. And we now have 4 sites. We have a new management team. You will have seen announcements regarding the restructuring of the team. So we recruited in France. And also in Germany, we changed the advertising unit, changed management.

And then there was a launch of Unify advertising, which was presented to the media agencies and all web advertisers. And then the synergies between Unify and the TF1 group, and we'll be coming back to that as well, but I must say that this is quite significant. So it's a transition year, which, in terms of results isn't the best, but we do have here the fundamentals for takeoff in 2020.

So what have we done to meet the challenges? First, the relaunch of the brands and the scaling up of brands. Unify has some very strong titles here with Marmiton amongst others. And we also sought to improve the user experience. Some hadn't developed mobile apps yet. Websites had to be freshened up. And so all this was challenged and is now starting to bear fruit. And then we expanded social e-commerce with My Paris, which is developing in a quite spectacular way. We strengthened this. So we have My Little Box and Gambettes Box and Beautiful Box, which deals in cosmetics, and this is carried by Aufeminin. We're up 11% for all these boxes. [EUR 200,000] per month. So we're becoming quite an industrial player, and we definitely are strongly present on the market.

And then we capitalized on growth markets, buying programmatic ads. You may remember, at the end of 2018, Gamned!, a very small dynamic group developing in France and abroad, and we've also migrated to more community value-based models, like My Little Paris, a lot of communities through newsletters. And now we have a value created for the community, just an example, because it is the most advanced, but Doctissimo and Aufeminin will be following suit.

If you look at Marmiton, 4,000 videos, over 7,000 recipes, with strength and presence on social networks. Historically, it wasn't very present on social networks. So now that has changed. So there are exchanges, a lot of synergies. And we were able to strengthen Marmiton's presence on social networks. So we have 350,000 videos seen per year. That is 50% year-on-year. So setting up these videos means that it's nice to read a recipe, but if you can actually see how to put together the dish, it's a definite plus. And I cook myself, so I know what I'm talking about.

So brand recognition. 21.4 million monthly users. That's 1 in 3 people in France. And from the 31st ranking, Marmiton is now within the top 15 on France's most powerful digital brands, so up 16 places. And you see here on the right, 21.4 million digital users, 3 million fans on Facebook, for instance. So we have the initial synergies with TF1.

The first short program, De l'astuce a l'assiette with recipes which are then available on Marmiton's website, and the first television campaign of Gambettes Box. And there, again, we had synergies with the group. So that's what I wanted to share with you regarding these successes for 2019.

And I shall now hand over to Philippe, who will be presenting the results.


Philippe Denery, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Executive VP of Finance & Procurement [4]


[Interpreted] Thank you, Gilles. Good morning. I'm going to talk to you about the results and the highlights for fiscal 2019. You can find this posted on our TF1 website. You'll have the detailed financial statements, consolidated, parent company and appendices, as we always post these on the website.

2019. First of all, I'd like to recall, as you saw in the press release, we have growth in revenue, 2.1% growth. Operating income is also up, as you said, by 2.2 points. We can say that this shows the great performance of 2019 in terms of growth in revenue and also growth in profitability. Of course, it's very important to underscore that fact.

Now revenue. Our revenue is EUR 2.337 billion, which is up EUR 49 million. If we dive into further detail broken down by business, Broadcasting up EUR 10.5 million, standing at EUR 1.774 billion. As we've heard, advertising revenue is slightly down, minus 1.3%. Recall that the previous year, baseline comparison effect was favorable. In the same scope, we had revenue and advertising. Broadcasting, plus 2.1%. So clearly, the effect of the World Cup, we see a growth over a 2-year period. This year, the baseline comparison effect will be very high. And in Q4, performance is satisfactory in spite of the 2 events that we mentioned earlier, the Rugby Cup, World Cup mentioned by Gilles and also some difficulties we encountered towards December.

Other non-advertising income for Broadcasting, 206 -- EUR 207 million, up 17.8%. This other revenue is a growth of EUR 31 million. Three reasons for this. First reason, the full year effect of income from operator contracts in 2019. Full year effect -- we hadn't previously had a full year effect in '18. Second reason, the second component is selling sports rights. We sold rights for the Women's World Cup. And the third reason, very good performance in broadcasting interactivity. '18 had already been a very good year for this. We continue to see this in that -- growth in that area.

Next, move on to Studios & Entertainment, you can see EUR 390 million, a drop by EUR 18.6 million. This drop is only due to deconsolidation effect from the Téléshopping division over a 9-year period. Excluding the deconsolidation impact, we'd see up -- an increase of EUR 25-some million in this segment. EUR 25 million, that's a good combination of both of the main activities. Production and sale of audiovisual rights, EUR 263 million. That means up EUR 10.2 million. That growth is mainly due to the development of new and internationally, as Gilles explained to us a moment ago, and also thanks to also a very good performance in our music division. The minus EUR 28 million -- we're growing EUR 126 million, you have to factor in Téléshopping. So the minus 18% becomes a plus EUR 15 million, a like-for-like scope. So that's up EUR 15 million for revenue from games, particularly due to a very good performance in music business.

On to Digital. Revenue is EUR 173 million. This is growing by EUR 57 million. In our last year, EUR 116 million. This was consolidation over an 8-month period. EUR 173 million is consolidation over the 12-month period. Complicated to do comparisons, but I'd remind you, we've said that like-for-like, the basis was EUR 155 million to EUR 160 million. So a slight growth in business.

I'd say that there's growth internationally, which is a little bit weaker, especially in Q4, as you will have observed.

Good performance in France in the various business areas of Unify.

Cost of programming, Gilles mentioned this, EUR 985 million, an improvement of EUR 28.8 million. All of the genres are down, except for variety. I'll come back to the point later. You can see drama, telefilms, series, plays have seen improvement, reduced costs in other words. EUR 16.4 million is the drop in costs, mainly due to optimization work for optimizing our rights. On this portion, we broadcast 11 additional dramas versus the previous year. So it's an increase in broadcasting and better optimization enabling us to make some savings on this type of programming.

Films, mainly the drop here in cost is mainly due to drop in the cost -- unit cost of broadcast films, EUR 134.7 million for news. So a slight drop in cost of news programming.

Sports. So you can see the impact of the World Cup last year, soccer cup, compared to the Rugby Cup and the Women's Cup. Then above and beyond the differences this year and last year, there are some savings that were conducted on sports programs.

Now varieties, games and magazines, up EUR 32 million. As Gilles said, it's very important there's investing in this category of programming, a fresh variety of gameshows and magazines. So we've seen a number of broadcast program -- additional programs versus previous years. You'll also have seen especially this was in Q4 to be seen, as I mentioned earlier.

Operating profit, EUR 255 million. Margin rate, 10.1%, an improvement of 2.2 points. If we look at growth by area, Broadcasting, double digit, 10.5% growth and EUR 185 million. This improvement in operating margin for Broadcasting is thanks to good cost of -- control of cost of programming, as we have just said, plus, excluding programming costs, other costs are also down, such as staff costs like-for-like are down, same scope, improving our productivity, therefore.

Another explanation of this is revenues, non-advertising revenues and also, of course, the impact of the addition we're receiving through our telco operators contracts.

Studios & Entertainment, EUR 57.9 million. Current operating profit up by EUR 20 million. Very good operating margin, 14.8%. This improvement in margin and operating profit is due to strong growth in production activities internationally, which contribute to operating profit for the group now in a very significant way now.

Furthermore, very good performance, as we mentioned earlier, when it comes to growth in operating profit in music business.

I'd also recall the following, studios. We restructured studios and video business 2 years back. Now the restructuring is completed and yielding positive results to compare with other results pre-restructuring that were slightly negative. So therefore, there's an improvement in this division's profitability for these various reasons we've given.

Digital, now. Unify operating profit, EUR 11.7 million, slightly below its level in 2018 by EUR 600,000. This result can be explained for several reasons. First of all, the reorganization that Gilles alluded to generating nonrecurring costs, just a few million during the year, which we will not see appear again in upcoming years. Furthermore, we've got accounting effects such as for the depreciation of goodwill. If you look at the detail of our financials, you'll see that this division under EBITDA grows versus the previous year, 18.7% versus 17.7%. So EBITDA for Unify going up, even though the operating -- current operating profit due to amortizations of goodwill is slightly down. There have been no depreciation of goodwill in the previous year.

For the fourth point under Unify. If you take a look at the trend, you will observe that in Q4, even though there's a drop in revenue due to international business at Unify, which is somewhat down towards the end of the year, but we'd expect that, there's also some reorganization in Germany and the United States. Overall, current operating profit for Unify at Q4 is improving, improving by around 20%, going from EUR 7.3 million to EUR 8.9 million, which makes us confident in the future and in the guidance that we've given.

Consolidated income statement. I won't come back to consolidated revenue or cost of programming, which I already talked about. Other charges, depreciation and amortization, up EUR 1.96 billion, which might appear somewhat contradictory with the points I just made in terms of reduction in expenses. But we're talking about expenses in other scopes. When we buy companies and we consolidate, we've got revenue and expenses we're consolidating. This is logical. Excluding the impact of scope changes, there is an improvement by EUR 22 million, not a drop, and an increase in cost by EUR 21.5 million, which you'll readily understand. So like-for-like, same scope, we've got a drop in costs for the entire group, same scope. So which leads to the current operating profit, which I've just said, EUR 255 million, and net profit, EUR 155 million, which is up by 21.3%.

2 lines I'd specify. The first one, other income EUR 6.5 million negative versus EUR 4.8 million positive last year for other financial income and expenses. We had a specific capital gain last year on the sale of Kids. That was the line item. That capital gain only happened once. Nonrecurring, therefore, we won't have it this year. However, this year, we do have, and we'll have this on a regular basis, on this line will have changes in puts, minority puts within the scope having to do with stakes, minority stakes that we hold, for instance, at Newen or Unify. This is a financial expense, which we book in our financials. Has to do with future costs for minorities.

Another point on share of profits and losses of associates. The EUR 6 million negative here you see is mainly related to depreciations, vertical station ex MinuteBuzz, which is factored into this or to the results, and in net earnings. That was an impairment. The equity affiliates up until last -- they were equity affiliates until last year.

The balance sheet, no main comments here. You can see it reflects an increase in goodwill as well as minority costs both under assets and liabilities. You can see overall net debt, up EUR 126 million, which we can see here. Change in net debt going from 31 December 2018, minus EUR 27 million to minus EUR 126.3 million. Our cash flow is improving, EUR 416.6 million, up EUR 56 million. The interesting thing for us is to look at this -- look at it in conjunction with operating expenditure and production to generate cash flow, but you'll also have to fund operations. Amount of investments in operations for the year, EUR 247 million, up EUR 36 million versus EUR 56 million.

So we can say, all in all, this is positive. The variance is positive, very positive indeed. Working capital requirements, operational WCR deterioration versus previous years, mainly due to consolidation in Q4 of Reel One Premiere Bobine, an activity which was very strong at the end of the year, and which presupposes prefinancing and production as well as tax credits, which explained why last year we had to -- had Reel One and we had a deterioration in WCR, which is included in structural due to the type of activity of production. Nothing disquieting here, just taking account of that effect, plus there's a slide effect in advertising, less significant, though, for WCR purposes.

So all in all, you can see the acquisitions, EUR 132 million. Just 3 phenomenon, acquisitions of De Mensen, Gilles mentioned, and the Reel One Premiere Bobine in Canada as well as increase in our stake in PlayTwo, which is the music division, which is also included under EUR 132 million, EUR 1-3-2 million. So as you can see, a difference in -- a difference of EUR 100 million in net debt is mainly due to acquisitions carried out during the year, EUR 130 million worth.

All in all, therefore, cash generated during the year increases, excluding the effect of acquisitions, of course.

Guidance. We confirm, firstly, double-digit current operating margin for 2020, cost of programs at EUR 985 million. Our view is we should be able to stabilize this cost of programming. We already indicated EUR 990 million would be the average over a 2-year period.

Looking toward 2021, revenue at Unify, at least EUR 250 million. EBITDA margin 15% in 2021. Currently, just under 11% in 2019. Improvement in profitability of -- on capital employed versus 2018. Our return on capital employed in 2018 was 8.8%. This year, going to 9.6%, which is an improvement, and this should continue improving compared to 2018, looking toward 2021.

Lastly, return to shareholders, the Board of Directors of TF1 group proposes the AGM on 17th April pay a dividend of EUR 0.50, which is up compared to last year by EUR 0.10. This is -- our dividend's policy has been a constant. 68% of the '18 profits, 66% of [2018] profits. This is a reflection for shareholders of the performance of 2019 being [60%] of 2019.

I've finished, and I will hand over now to talk about 2020.


Gilles Christian Gérard Pélisson, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Chairman & CEO [5]


[Interpreted] So we move to the third part of the presentation with opportunities for a Total Video group. Now I wanted to start here with the content, the variety and strength of the content, but I don't think that our creative teams are probably best to talk about this, so we'll show you a short video.



Gilles Christian Gérard Pélisson, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Chairman & CEO [6]


Well, so that's just a glimpse of 2020. We have high hopes in terms of content. But I think that the important news here is for April, with a change in which television will be measured with television, which is available via programmatic and data target, but it will become segmented and accessible to all advertisers.

So I mentioned the EUR 27 million unlocked. The advertising union announced One Pay TV, which will also be a change and will bring us even closer to agencies and advertisers. But what is going to change above all is the way audience is measured. And I want to stress this Mediametrie, which measures audiences, will make available to us an additional tool. On the left, you have MÉDIAMAT NOW that is 3.5 hours, which measures TV viewing in the home. And in April, we will have Out-of-Home and On-the-Move measuring. That is vacations, weekend breaks, holiday homes, et cetera. And On-the-Move, here we refer to bars, train stations, airports, public spaces and the like.

Now what's important here is that first tests that have been run by Mediametrie show that television might be regaining 10 to 15 minutes of additional audience. So you can imagine what that means for us in terms of monetization. And then at some time this year, it's just been done slightly, we will have the measuring of online screens in the home. So if you are watching via the web that will also be taken into account. And here, we are talking potentially about an additional 2.5 minutes. So this will allow better monetization and our advertising unit is already active here because we were to publish our tariffs for the EURO 2020 championships this week. And this is already up against what might have been envisaged previously.

Now 2020, we'll be focusing on 2 complementary models which now support a concept of a Total Video Group. So you have the mass media, traditional television, focusing on unmissable events and flagship programs. And for years now, we've been saying content is king. And it is the strength of content which has made the strength of TF1. But nowadays, we want to add to that. And in 2019, I already mentioned the personalized on-demand consumption on a mass scale. And this is based not only on content quality, but also on technology and data. So if you want to have an idea of what our keys to future success are to be, that is total video based on content, tech and data. And that is why we are looking forward to value creation through segmented TV. The law on audiovisual, current regulations make us ensure continuous signal, so make no difference between French citizens. So that is quite the opposite of Internet.

So how can we move from today's situation to tomorrow's with segmented TV, with a targeted advertising tailor-made for each viewer, each consumer with specific programs. And given the great variety of programs, especially on MYTF1, you can just imagine how infinite the possibilities will be. So we'll be able to attract new types of advertisers at relatively low prices, and we'll be able to expand our offering. I was mentioning the importance of targeted offers. But with segmented TV, we'll be able to go even further. The estimate is that the market represents about EUR 200 million. We think the first tests will be run -- the first pilots will be run in Q3.

Now that is very positive. And then there will be an extra brick in the wall in 2020 for the improvement of our viewers' experience. And I'm referring to SALTO. You know that together with Delphine Arnault, Nicolas Tavernost at M6, I was very much in favor of setting up this major French platform showcasing the best of French content. So we bring together the 3 groups, and that means that we have 3.5 billion in French-speaking content, which is unrivaled. So we've made a start. We have Thomas Follin, who is manager, and I am also involved with the launching of SALTO. 15,000 hours of content across all genres, very soon to reach 20,000 hours, with first-run content every month. If you think of Bazar de la Charité and then Capitaine Marleau and then the best of the upcoming season of l'Amour est dans le pré. So you can see what the references would be very, very attractive and strong content. And there will be a recommendation system, which will be fronted by celebrities, by influencers. And then local specificities and in terms of timing, we're thinking -- we're looking at a pre-launch pilot in June and the commercial launch in September.

The EUR 45 million per share -- holding for the 3 groups. And as Thomas said, content will be such that it would be EUR 260 million to be spent or invested over the 3 years to come regarding SALTO. And then subscription rates, which would be competitive as compared to other platforms, somewhere between EUR 5 and EUR 10. And this will be revealed in June.

Now Newen and the continued acceleration of the business and the partnerships. Newen has set up its central galaxy of French and international companies, and it is now capitalizing on it. This can bring about synergies between the various group entities and also responded to demand for content.

I mentioned Band of Spies. And that is codevelopment between Capa, the well-known French company -- they made Versailles at the time for Canal, and the new acquisition that is Reel One Entertainment. And together, they are going to develop an 8-episode series about Mossad agents. Team Chocolate, developed by our friends at De Mensen in Belgium and Reel One will step in as well. This is a young Down Syndrome sufferer. And it was a very good idea on the part of the Belgians, which we are taking up and adapting. Kamp Waes, this was selected in Belgium, together with Belgium Special Forces and citizens who might want to join the special forces. It's produced in the shape of an 8-episode series. It's quite spectacular. The Dutch neighbors at Tuvalu are also interested, and they'll be selling it in the Netherlands, rather like what was done in Belgium.

Now we continue to win new clients. There will be some spectacular announcements regarding platforms as Newen clients.

Now Undercover. You may have seen Undercover on the Canal channels. It's produced for Netflix. There is talk of a third season and even of a film. So that is a wonderful opportunity. Companies like De Mensen, through these platforms, find their place internationally. And then Reel One, and now there are films that are very interesting, but platforms are interested in TV movies as well. So Reel One has just made its first sales to Netflix in Canada, New Zealand and Amazon Prime in the U.K. They are now starting to buy these television films.

So we expect an increase in business for Newen. The order book in 2018 was over EUR 1 million in projects, in 1,000 hours. And now at the end of 2019, we reached over 1,500 hours. Revenue will be balanced between France and international for 2020. So you see that there has been a step change for this company that we acquired in 2016. And then wide-scale distribution because there is a catalog of television films now, so over 5,000 hours for the Newen Group, and then the Head of Distribution for Newen, [Rodolphe Buet,] that's Head of Distribution for Newen Group and the TF1 Studio, we're talking about a 20 sales positions -- or sales positions in about 20 countries.

Now Unify. As I was saying earlier, Olivier Abecassis and his team's work for the restructuring in 2019 will bring about the expected rebound in 2020. And there are different aspects to this. First of all, it is supported by the increase in advertising revenue with programmatics and direct sales. And on the French market, for the first time, customers of a certain size are now showing interest for Unify. And with the help of the major TF1 advertising unit, we are able to look in that direction.

We have 2 advertising units, but they do communicate. So talking about unifying Unify advertising, well, this is something we could be looking at. And now we're launching our brands. I told you about the significant results with Marmiton. We'll be continuing along those lines with Aufeminin. And we are thinking of many more videos for social platforms. And we're going to be working on Doctissimo with even better medical expertise. And then we have international expansion of My Little Paris. So we are present in France, in Germany, but there's also Japan. And in 2020, the focus will be on Germany. And then the rollout of what we call business solutions that is mainly for advertisers in France and beyond, with Gamned!, which is very strong in France, with Switzerland, Belgium and the Middle East. Ykone, which works with influencer, strongly present in France and the Middle East. So that is what we could say about the various divisions and their work rollout in 2020.

Before we come to conclusions, I wanted to talk about this. Initially, I talked about our company purpose and our inspiration. I want to recall that the group has responsibilities and duties, and I want to talk about our commitment. There are 3 pillars for our social commitment: diversity, solidarity and, of course, a sustainable society. Now what is new or what you may not be so aware of beyond the Fondation TF1 and the work with some 130 associations here at TF1. So what is new?

We are focusing on Ushuaia. We have this channel which initially was brought about by Nicolas Hulot. We've just strengthened it and its presentation. And Fanny Agostini is a very well-known presenter, will be hosting Mission [Inter-femmes]. This is close to nature, so we are putting more of this sort of thing on channels. Then Marmiton, this is a response to our citizens' interest in better food, short circuits, organic food. So we can focus on that. And then Newen recently had launched its foundation to improve access to production careers, especially in the poorer neighborhoods with a school which should help to improve things within our society. And then there are extra financial rating agencies which have recognized our CSR policy. And that, of course, is very important. And therefore, we are present in their various indexes.

So to conclude, as you will have understood, when we look to 2020 and beyond, what we are referring to is sustainable growth and many opportunities. So for 2020, there will be an upward revision of TV consumption with the new audience metrics, on the part of Mediametrie; and then there is tech-driven advertising, programmatic TV and segmented advertising if it is brought about in France; and then there will be tighter control over the cost of programs, as Philippe said, and double-digit margin, maintained, which is confirmed; and then the audiovisual rapport might open up new prospects. And here, I refer to segmented television and SALTO is a wonderful opportunity for our contents and in order to improve customer experience and improve the TF1 experience. Newen, international expansion with new customers in the shape of Internet platforms. And then Unify with sound fundamentals and they will allow for strong, sustainable growth. That is our hope. So a Total Video Group.

Thank you very much, and we shall now move on to Q&A with Philippe.


Questions and Answers


Conor O'Shea, Kepler Cheuvreux, Research Division - Head of Media Sector [1]



Conor O'Shea with Kepler Cheuvreux. I have a couple of questions. First of all, studio. You saw the end of the year. How can you explain this stepped-up growth in Q4? Were they phasing effects? Scope effects, maybe? Do you think 15 -- almost 15% margins will be sustainable in the long haul?

Second question, advertising -- the advertising market. I'd like to know what are the initial indications at the beginning of the year. And thinking of your peers, they're talking about stable markets in 2020. Is that also your view for advertising?

Thirdly, Unify. Again, we heard about this, this morning from peers. Apparently, required consent and so forth from the authorities will become tougher and tougher. You've talked about Unify advertising down in '19 before the relaunch of sites and so forth. What do you think about that subject? Are you worried about those points for 2020?


Unidentified Company Representative, [2]



On your first question regarding Newen, broadly entertainment studios, growth is due to the dephasing end of the year. We announced this to you. The 3 -- the first quarters of the year, down mainly, we said for seasonal reasons, reasons of delivery programs by Newen and so forth. This would mainly have an effect in Q4. What you said is what happens. That's pretty much good news. That was bolstered by an additional phenomenon, which is a consolidation of Reel One. Reel One became part of consolidation. In future years, we have to realize their business is more significant and a greater contribution, mainly towards the end of the year, particularly in Q4, versus the first 3 quarters of the year. So there is a seasonal effect there also for TV movies, which comes into play in Newen's cycle. So a very good year, Newen, in all likelihood. Maybe the pace will slow down slightly at the beginning of 2020. I'd like to let you know that pace of deliveries may change slightly. So yes, great performance, great performance. Delay in the first 9 months, then a bit ahead of the loop in the following months, ahead of schedule, and then Reel One's contribution.

On margins, our expectation is growth in revenue, growth in business in studio and entertainment division in upcoming years. We do not expect an improvement in profitability. We're reaching profitability levels that are already high. Possibly we'll do even better than this. But at this level of profitability, this is a very good level. And we need to hold it at this level.

Regarding the advertising marketplace. At the beginning of the year is fine. Just a couple of months now. You're familiar with the seasonal effects. The market is fairly stable. So no special points, no big thing going upward nor downward. The market is going to really change starting in April. The new way of measuring viewership will lead to adjustments necessarily. Outlook for growth, we hope, in the market.

Now on to privacy consent, private information -- privacy authorities has to do with our websites, Unify and MYTF1. No impact for the time being with GPRD on the way we operate. No expectation of a drop in revenues, which you could be alluding to. However, we're keeping a careful eye on any attempt to increase what's going on in GAFAN: Google, Facebook et al, versus circulation elsewhere in the marketplace.

Just like all the other companies, web companies in France and in Europe, we're keeping a very careful eye, very attentive to what our authorities are doing and make sure they don't create an additional -- yet another obstacle, which would further increased the difference in some uses on consent versus the outside world, the GAFAN players elsewhere, when you go to their websites.


Jérôme Bodin, ODDO BHF Corporate & Markets, Research Division - Analyst [3]



Jérôme Bodin, ODDO BHF. I have 3 questions. Firstly, on Newen, a follow-up on the question we had on profitability. Is there a trend? What about the weighting, production versus rights sold in '19? Rights increased. The expectation would be overall trend increase in margin, is that sustainable? First question.

Second question, MYTF1, you said growth, 8% in revenues, 2019, with increased prices and volumes. But beginning of your presentation, you also talked about viewership up 35%. It was hard for me to bring this together. Does that mean there was dropping prices for some videos and not others? I don't know, volumes up 35% on the one hand.

So second question, advertising marketplace. Is it correct to assume that in Q1, beginning of the year, beginning of the quarter, January was tough because of strikes? But there's an improvement since then in Feb, in other words? And do you think further improvement in March?


Philippe Denery, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Executive VP of Finance & Procurement [4]



On the first point, profitability of Newen, we're not just talking about Newen's profitability when we say entertainment. They're included and make a significant big contribution no doubt about it.

Next point, you're not wrong in saying the rights portion should increase, but offset by some adjustments in production. Newen, therefore, is a component both in production and in distribution. Cycles necessarily don't go in lockstep. What we can say -- and depending on client and type of programs, their variation. But generally, at Newen, improvement is likely for profitability in the distribution portion, rights distribution offset, all in all, by a slightly lower profitability because somewhat nonrecurring this year for some programs, particularly internationally. Regarding profitability of Newen subsidiaries internationally, which is very good this year. The trend will weaken slightly, but it will be offset by distribution. I hope that answers more or less your fairly technical questions.

On the second subject, on MYTF1, Gilles can build on this, but I would just recall the following: growth in MYTF1 -- for the full year MYTF1 was reviewed, revamped, upgraded midway through the year. So if we're talking about revenue growth for the year, it's not a full reflection of the potential of MYTF1. The full year for MYTF1, there should be a more significant improvement in 2020 that will be the full year effect. The 8% improvement we see is the ability we had to sell MYTF1's inventory over a 6-month period with growth, but it's still below volume growth. So the first stage in our businesses, any business, MYTF1 or channels is to get to viewership and then sell it and have marketing. So the wrap-up of MYTF1 will be completed in 2020. And you're right, plus 35% on the one side and plus 24%. There's a slight variance, a slight difference, and it should self-adjust, as we've mentioned, as the sales and marketing takes place.

Advertising Q1. Advertising marketplace is difficult to explain. We tend to summarize the broad market and say there are strikes, there aren't strikes, there are the yellow vests or there aren't and so forth. And that's oversimplification. And it's not really the basics. The basics in the advertising market, even though there are impacts of other elements, but what we'd say is this: the 2-month period, January, February, are weak months versus March, less substantive in the whole of the quarter. January and February, we can say, overall, we're in -- seeing things in line with last year's levels, which were already slightly improving over the previous year. We realized, last year, maybe because of the yellow vests, or maybe because of some of the changes in advertising -- advertisers' behavior, that January was somewhat better. In the past, January and February tended to have a big impact due to retail negotiations with producers. Up until 2 years ago, the negotiations, the changes were felt not just in Jan/Feb but toward March. But due to changes in regulations in the distribution sector, there have been a difference this year. Jan and Feb, therefore, we can say have been positive, as we had also seen last year. Nevertheless, the base for comparison is slightly high, January and February. Currently, though, our view is that January and February look all right, fine. But it's early days to really give a specific Q1 indication because of the importance of March. We don't have any worries, no concerns, though we wouldn't say that Q1 will see strong growth because of the way the first quarters are.

The market tends to take a look at previous quarters, and strong viewership, good viewership, strong performance of TF1 viewing numbers leads us to think that in times of negotiations, and if you look at our channels, there's going to be a lot of demand for us. We know that people in our advertising units are put in a good position for these talks, as opposed to other areas. So we can say that we're in a good position here. And we can be fairly optimistic. We're certainly cautious as to the overall market size, market stability and market trends. We're talking about the share of that market which will be our share.


Annick Tonie Maas, Exane BNP Paribas, Research Division - Analyst [5]



Annick Maas from Exane Paribas. I have a first question on program costing, the EUR 985 million, does that include sports? Second question. The EUR 985 million, is it going to be the same in future years as well? Another question has to do with Newen. You said you were expecting ex revenue 50-50 for this year. Is that your best-case scenario? Or are you expecting other acquisitions, particularly international ones in that division?

Two further brief questions. Just one, could you give us an indication of restructuring costs at Unify 2019? Last question, something about the reform, an idea. What about some degrees that might have an impact, some legislation could have impact this year? Could you talk to us about where things stand in terms of legislative reform?


Philippe Denery, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Executive VP of Finance & Procurement [6]



Subject one, cost of programming. EUR 985 million. We'll give no guidance as to the continuation, first of all, because we look at 2020 first and then we'll see what happens later. But broadly, what we would say, 2 points on that, first of all, you must remember, every 4 years there's a World Soccer Cup, a slight adjustment for those years that we do hope cost of those rights for free-to-air channels won't go up. There's no reason they should. As we always have for 4 years now, we'll manage the reselling and sharing of some of the rights. So yes, EUR 985 million includes sports events.

Secondly, yes, broadly, that's the amount we want to invest normatively, but it's less and less meaningful, fairly, in a Total Video Group. I'd remind you, these programming costs historically saw ad revenues in our channels, but now it's non-advertising revenue such as the telecom operators, digital revenue through replay. So we're focusing on this indicator starting in 2021, using a slightly different tack versus cost of programming as such, which is very important to keep an eye on. It represents spending investments, but must be viewed, as you said, an understanding of part of a video group. As you've seen -- at least as much or more a video group as a TV group. And as Gilles had said, we'll continue keeping those indicators, the total video division indicators. And just is also considering indicators from the TV division.

On our first point -- on to Newen now, just like for Unify, I think that with the chiefs of these business units. We're on the lookout for any and all possibilities. We don't have a hard and fast acquisitions program. We do feel that the 2 divisions will continue growing with limited-sized acquisitions. Possibly, if they'd be meaningful if it makes sense, we could make the acquisitions to add to the galaxy out of the array if possible. It's a possibility, and we have the resources to do so. Unify restructuring costs this year, a few million, not much more than 2. EUR 11.7 million, these are nonrecurring costs as the order of magnitude, the restructuring costs. We don't give a specific figure, though. The reason for this, we could talk forever, what we include under restructuring costs because we're reorganizing, restructuring. But that's overall the order of magnitude. We realized though these are one-off, one-shot costs. To build on what Gilles said in his answer, I confirm, yes, in our guidance and in our view, as we've already said, the 2 divisions, Newen and Unify will have organic growth fueled through external growth to do with Newen this year. We're talking about an overall policy, the overall understanding of the activities in those 2 divisions.

As to the audiovisual legislation rules and regulations, it's all a work in progress. It's a long saga. We think that we will see things wrap up in the near-ish future. People are talking about April now. Apparently, a lot's been decided regarding movies shown on TV, prohibited days and so forth. We don't think it's going to cause market upheaval. Movies not making that much money and TV institutions actually are losing money on movies. We don't think the competitors will be showing dozens of movies. There's going to be the split screen, which will be pretty good for advertising business. That will be less of a break in programming. If you want to watch a program, for instance, sports, this is already done in a lot of countries in Europe. So there's various things that were lagging behind slightly, a little bit outdated in France, are going to be updated. The third advertising break for long movies and so forth.

Next, more complicated matters. Of course, opening movie advertising on TV. As weeks go by, that subject becomes more acute. We see the various platforms investing in our channels for their programming. Think of Netflix, think of Amazon and so forth. In the TF1 advertisements, you've got advertising for them. And we coproduce films, but we're not entitled to get the benefits of promoting those films in the same way. It's kind of weird. So we think that we're the only country in Europe, remember, that's not able to get cinema advertising on TV. And that also should potentially be settled.

Address TV. It's kind of a weird discussion on that as well. I mean, conceivably, we could do this. If we don't give the advertisers' address on the advertisement, which is the antithesis of the Internet because Internet is going to be one-on-one relationship with people. So it's complicated to sell them something if we don't have that type of relationship with them. So work's in progress, and we hope that addressed advertising will be a possibility in France. But we have to draw a parallel with the GAFAN. In other words, we can't imagine that in a world of Facebook and YouTube, that they'd have that freedom. They'd have that ability of communicating directly and using the data at their fingertips at the GAFAN. Whereas we, as the other guys, when we want to set up addressed advertising, we're subject to restrictions, which then means it's not in the interest of an advertiser to do it, but that's the crux of the matter. And that's -- discussion is underway.

There's also a discussion with the producers and broadcasters. These are discussions that are underway.


Gilles Christian Gérard Pélisson, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Chairman & CEO [7]



And to add a little something, as some say, in our budgets, we haven't included the impact of the 2020 audiovisual legislation reform. So it means that there could be a plus.

No more questions? Are there any questions on Internet?


Operator [8]


We have a question from Chris Johnen, HSBC.


Christopher Johnen, HSBC, Research Division - Analyst [9]


My first question is again on studios. Could you please let us know organic performance in 2019 at studios? And maybe a bit more color on the Reel One consolidation effect in Q4? Then coming back to the MYTF1 commentary for -- so I'm not sure if I didn't get the translation fully. But I mean, you had 8% revenue growth on 22% video growth. You said in the press release that the CPMs are actually up. So I quite didn't get that. So that means that you have less inventory that you had for ad slots? Or how does that work?

And then the last question on the double-digit margin guidance. I mean you obviously just said that the audiovisual reform isn't included. But you chose to keep it relatively vague. I mean you didn't say expect margins to stay at 2019 levels. You didn't say you expect it to be better than 2019. Is there any more color you can give us on that? It feels that you're trending a better performance than what you had in 2019.

And then last question on your non-advertising revenues in Broadcasting. I mean it was actually flat in Q4, and I'm not quite sure why. Because if I'm understanding correctly, on the carry side there should have been growth and there should have been other areas growing as well. You mentioned positive interactivity. Can you just let us know what happened on that side of the revenues in -- within Broadcasting in Q4?


Unidentified Company Representative, [10]


(foreign language)


Stéphanie Laval, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Head of Financial Communication and IR [11]


(foreign language)


Unidentified Company Representative, [12]



Now to your first point, studio and organic growth, and the organic growth is very low this year. It comes mainly from external growth, our organic growth is virtually stable for Newen, with strong growth from international development, as I said.

Now as to the contribution of Reel One in Q4, the amount, the corresponding amount is just over EUR 10 million in revenue. As to MYTF1, may I remind you that MYTF1 was revisited and revamped. We launched the new MYTF1 towards the middle of the year. So revenue growth is lower than overall growth of video seen and consumption. It's over a 6-month period in terms of revenue. So we feel that things will improve in 2020 based on fundamentals that have been revamped and only covered 6 months.

Now for 2020, double digits. Well, if we were fully able to give you the figures after the point, we would, but what I think I can say is that we are looking at double-digit again. I would say that, that is important. Of course, I can't tell you now. But of course, we'll be doing everything to improve, of course, but there are a certain number of uncertainties regarding 2020, which aren't totally in our hands. They're beyond our control.

Now as to the last point, for Q4, there is no increase in non-advertising revenue. Last year, we'd already included the contracts from operators. So the full quarter effect no longer stands for Q4 because we signed with operators for the 9 first months of 2018, and for the last 3 months of 2018 we already had full effect of these contracts. And then secondly, the sale of sporting rights with the Women's World Cup, of course, came in before the broadcast. So there are no sporting rights here for Q4.

As to interactivity, it is still growing in Q4, but less significantly so because progress was mainly booked over the summer. But there is a slight growth, which isn't that visible in the figures. It's not as significant as for the beginning of the financial year.

Do we have another question?


Operator [13]


[Interpreted] We have a question from Julien Roch from Barclays.


Julien Roch, Barclays Bank PLC, Research Division - MD & European Media Analyst [14]



Well, first of all, Gilles, you were saying that total video was definitely TF1's future. But we don't really have any metrics to follow this because you are giving us the audience figures for channels, a number of videos for TF1, so you can't really compare. Could we possibly have the number of minutes for 2019, daily figures in order to be able to see what percentage of your consumption is de-linearized? That's my first question.

Second question, Philippe said that in Q3 there would be KPIs on production, and I didn't really see anything. So what would be the key KPIs on production?

And thirdly, what could you say about SALTO's positioning? Because my impression was that it was a platform which was advertising-based and what we hear is that it will be subscription-based, so SVOD or AVOD?


Gilles Christian Gérard Pélisson, Télévision Française 1 Société anonyme - Chairman & CEO [15]



First subject on metrics that some of the peers give, it's true. Today, we are ensuring the relevance, the clear relevance of these, how we calculate them and how we do comparisons versus what we used previously. It's difficult to look at minutes on TV versus minutes on Internet and how you can come up with really the right indicator that's a reliable one. You're familiar, before using an indicator at TF1, we want to make sure it's auditable, so to speak. And that it's sustainable and these are the right indicators for the long term. So yes, we'll certainly come back to you. Today, though, we cannot give you here and now right away a number of minutes for all of our media, but we will come back to you with this.

Just to talk to you about indicators for a moment. The important thing is today's world, if you look at the GAFAN, today's world, you've seen, as we have, it's not an exact science of metrics for the media. Whenever there's a correction from Facebook or what have you, they say all of a sudden, "Oh, videos that we shouldn't have tallied up and so forth." With Mediametrie, we're at the peak of our art. And we're crafting a new measurement. So you'll see we're fairly cautious. We don't want to mix things up. We don't want to blend things wrongfully. It'll be interesting to see how the European peers do things. We use some of their -- so this is food for thought. We don't want to create any confusion in the TV marketplace. It's beautifully well measured now. It will be even better measured. It's even better measured than other media, and we don't want to mix things up with how the Internet's measured or not.

When you're talking about advertising business, the important thing is to look at the convergence going to CPM versus GRP. These are things that are being established to have measurement units you can use with the advertisers and media agencies that are meaningful. So we'll see that it would be possible to do the bridge for marketing purposes. So that's really where I'm headed and looking at it in the future saying that, yes, we will have a flow, a smooth flow marketing on linear and marketing on nonlinear markets, and this should be a smooth transition or flow.

And the second question. Sorry if I disappointed you, Julien. I'll try to do things better. But yes, we can give you more info. We've begun giving you more when we give you 1,500 hours order book versus 1,000, that's an indicator we didn't give you previously. So we'd given you a first indicator last year, but it wasn't comparable so there's no base for comparison. That's an important item, of course. In the financial statements, you can, if you look at operating investments, particularly in the balance sheet at current fixed assets, you can see changes, future expected changes in revenues. Indirectly, you can see an indication as to trends in Newen's business activity.

So we're beginning to give you some additional indicators. We'll continue doing this, and it's entirely true, we hope we'll be giving more and more indicators on Newen and Unify. We want to help get you the best understanding possible of these businesses.

Yes, SALTO, absolutely. At that point, to reduce any confusion or eliminate any confusion you might have in your mind, SALTO will be a for-pay platform. So it's a service that will be paid for. There'll be 3 components. They'll be broadcasting a linear TV, the major corporations, plus other groups could be accommodated.

Next, AVOD component with replay catch programs with advertising as little as possible, probably according to what the managing director is saying to us, Thomas Follin, but there will be some aspects of advertising. Then SVOD portion, where there shouldn't be any advertising. So that'll be the whole wealth of the offering, and that'll be the real plus of SALTO.

Are there no further questions? I believe there are no further questions. We thank you one and all for taking part. We'll see you soon. We'll see you very soon. And if you're here in the building, we'd like you to come have some beverages with us.

Portions of this transcript that are marked Interpreted were spoken by an interpreter present on the live call.